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06-30-2006, 05:34 PM
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#1 |
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CIVIL WAR CEASE FIRE AS BLACK PANTHER & STORM WED?
Press Release
Civil War has been tearing its way through the Marvel Universe as America has passed a Superhuman Registration Act, but will the fighting carry over to Wakanda when heroes on both sides of the conflict attend the royal wedding of the Black Panther and Storm in Black Panther #18. |
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06-30-2006, 05:45 PM
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#2 |
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I think it would be interesting to see both Anti & Pro have a food fight at the wedding. Yaay wedding cake!
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06-30-2006, 06:10 PM
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#3 |
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Usher: Whose side are YOU on?
Guest 1: I'm with Cap! Guest 2: I'm with Iron Man! Usher: ... actually, um, I meant, bride or groom? You know, for seating? Um. Nevermind. |
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06-30-2006, 06:15 PM
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#4 |
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I haven't picked up Black Panther in a while, ever since the blaxploitive nature of that New Orleans arc, but no way am I gonna miss this.
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06-30-2006, 06:54 PM
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#5 |
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My only experienc with Reginald Hudlin has been his run on 'Marvel Knights: Spider-Man' and the issues he did as part of "The Other" crossover, so you can't blame me for not having any inclination to pick up 'Black Panther'. But I must say, I'm suddenly quite interested in picking this issue up. And that's certainly saying a lot, because I really haven't been enjoying the build-up to this at all. But this certainly does sound interesting.
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06-30-2006, 07:58 PM
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#6 | ||
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Two things. One, Cage and Blade were inspired by Shaft, blaxploitation films' most popular hero. So, it would be silly not to pay homage to the genre when the Hero for Hire and the Daywalker teamed up with the Black Panther. Two, the sad truth is that the government bungled relief efforts in post-Katrina New Orleans sound like a plot for a blaxploitation movie. Hence, I was cheering when Black Panther took charge to save the mostly poor Black survivors from both vampires and FEMA red tape. On that note: http://www.hudlinentertainment.com/s...p?topic=1631.0 So, calling the second half of "Two the Hard Way" blaxploitative is frankly a compliment. Intentionally or not, Hudlin tapped into the best aspects of the movie genre, which focuses on Black heroes battling against those external and internal forces (racist cops, drug dealers, etc.) that were destroying Black America. This is one of the reasons why blaxploitation continues to affect not only Black people, but America as a whole. Quote:
You said it. In a time when many recent comic events are about death and destruction, Black Panther and Storm's wedding is a more upbeat breath of fresh air. zeraze |
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06-30-2006, 09:19 PM
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#7 | |
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I'll file it under the same category as Arana, Northstar, Batwoman, the new Blue Beetle, and just about every other character of color or non-traditional persuasion. If DC or Marvel REALLY want our dollars why not just craft more good stories. Stop talking down to us. Stop spoon feeding us this hype machine garbage. Sales of BP will rise. That's a no brainer. However, it's only a stop gap measure. Mark my words, the sales boost will be short lived. I know that I'll probably be flamed for this. I do. I'm just a little tired of seeing this type of pandering. About the only thing that makes me more ill is the way both companies can't live without the cliches of ethnicity and sexuality. I'm sick of the Spanglish. I'm sick of the played out "African Tribe VS Whitey" plot devices. I'm sick of .... Well, I'm sick of a lot.  Seriously though, both companies need better writing & editing. I can guarantee you that better writing and characterization will draw in more new readers than cheap tricks. 20 years from now, we'll look back on some of these things and find them to be the comic equivalent of "Amos & Andy" or the old "Slap a Jap" cover to Action Comic #58. (BTW, I feel that this is different than comic geared toward women. Not much, but still different. There's a striking difference between "Spider-Man Loves Mary Jane" and "Arana".) Anyway, this is a rant. I know that I'll probably be warned by the mods or something. However, cheap marketing does absolutely NOTHING for me. Blech! We really should not be supporting this type of "event". Peter & MJ Wedding... Good idea. Scott & Jean Wedding... Good idea. Storm & Black Panther... Contrived. Insulting. Weak. Last edited by cookepuss : 06-30-2006 at 09:24 PM. |
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06-30-2006, 10:23 PM
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#8 |
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"Hey, Iron Man! There's Captain America! Isn't he a wanted fugitive on the run from the combined powers of the North American government?"
"Yes, but he took a time out to attend this blessed union, nice fellow. You go distract him with shadow puppets while I jump him from behind!" "No! This is an independent nation and we have no say here." "Dang. I'll just glare at him angrily." "You're wearing a mask." "He'll get the point." "...damn, I can feel Tony glarring at me." |
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06-30-2006, 10:27 PM
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#9 |
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Y'know...haters are going to be haters no matter what, Zeraze. I never really got into the Priest run of Panther, but I did read select issues. All I know is that when this last *monumental* week of excellent comics came out, I pushed aside my Amazing Spider-Man #533 - an issue I couldn't WAIT to read, pushed aside New Avengers (another nail-biter), got a cup of my favorite tea, and plunked down in my favorite chair to read Black Panther and Storm. In that order.
I fiend for Black Panther every month in the same way that I used to crave Claremont's X-Men in the 80's. Every time there's a thread that talks smack about Hudlin and Panther (or any Black Creator and book), you valiantly come to the rescue. Dude, I gave up doing that because people walk in with their pre-formed opinions, ready to discredit ANYTHING. Instead, I simply buy extra copies and hand the book out to kids or donate them to a local library. I quit trying to argue with fanboys, dude. And to be honest? Hudlin DOES write that book with a nod to the black audience. Specifically, the black MALE. Every one of my boys - all late 20's/early 30's black college grads, pass that book around like it's a monthly check. There are soooo many in-jokes and moments that a black long-time comic-fan could appreciate, that it'd be a waste of time to list them all. That book is so good that I'm always crossing my fingers that it doesn't get cancelled -- but I'm always thanking my lucky stars that after 20+ years of reading, a book for ME finally exists again (I didn't forget you, Milestone). Kind of like season 2/3 and McDuffie's HUGE contribution to Justice League animated ;-) You can't erase that. Anyway...I'm waaaaay off topic. Nobody ever talks about how Marvel and the creative team has put more time into THIS union than even the Cage/Jessica Bendis love affair. Nobody talks about how the story of Panther/Storm, true, started with flimsy roots, but has become one of the best romances I've seen in comics in YEARS. Maybe it did come out of nowhere? Maybe it *was* forced? In the end, though? The story has been FANTASTIC and REAL. If you love Storm, nobody can argue that she hasn't been written this well in YEARS. That, and she's got one of the few X-Men Limited series that even MATTERS. So Zeraze, let haters moan. They're only loud on the Internet. Buy an extra copy and give it to some little kid. That's what I do. Makes me feel GREAT inside. And Reggie, if you ever read this, in your most recent Panther, you made reference about Black men and BRAZIL. What are you tryin' to do? Blow up the spot???!! LOL.... Laughs roared 'around the room on THAT one! Copacabana and Centarus FOREVER on that one! LOL... Thanks for such an excellent book, Reggie! Ride until the wheels fall off! And thanks to Joe Q. and Marvel's current editorial for even creating an environment for this to happen! --Shola Last edited by Shola Akinnuso : 06-30-2006 at 10:33 PM. |
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06-30-2006, 10:28 PM
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#10 |
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Sorry for the double post.
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06-30-2006, 11:30 PM
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#11 | |
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Uh.....is this still an all ages comic book?  |
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07-01-2006, 09:08 AM
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#12 | |
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I am African-American and I don't care if you are "Hispanic" or whatever. Your Amos and Andy comparison is ignorant and borderline racist. These two characters have a romantic history and a wedding between the two is logical and well-executed. |
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07-01-2006, 11:01 AM
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#13 | ||
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How many times have you seen a once respectable character dumped into the cookie cutter roles? Perfect example... Just read this month's New Avengers. How out of character was it for Bendis to write the Falcon with 70's-style dialogue? I swear, had the word "sucka" come out of his mouth I wouldn't have been surprised. Sadly, I don't know which is more offensive - writing him like a bad stereotype or writing him so far out of character. Call it what you will. If nothing else, its bad writing that borders on insensitivity. Another example. Look at Blue Beetle or Arana. A lot of kids actually learn stuff from comics. Scary, but true. If all we're teaching them is that Hispanic-Americans are incapable of forming coherent sentences then we're doomed as a society. Neither Spanglish nor Ebonics are actual languages. As a buying public, we should not embrace characters who embody that ignorance. Where are the characters of color to represent those of us who are well educated, well integrated, and well to do? I'm a thriving CG artist with my own visual effects business. I attended prep school & college. I'm not the stereotypical Catholic Hispanic. Heck, I'm an atheist actually. I speak perfect English and am a member of mensa. I don't speak a word of Spanish, but I do speak three (3) other languages. I may not be the norm, but I certainly represent a growing segment of the population. For writers to ignore the true effects of integration is just bologna. The fact of the matter is that it is not too off base for me to levy that "Amos & Andy" charge at these writers. Any time you buy one of these exploitative books you're being played for a fool. By "you" I mean the collective buying public, btw. You're helping to perpetuate culturally insensitive stereotypes and myths. Your buying dollar is helping to breed a nation of children who only see people of color through the eyes of writers who simply don't know how to write for said people. These comics do not live in isolation of one another. They must be taken as a whole. Look at the big picture. My original complaint will become clearer then. I'm going to ask you an honest question, DrCool976. Are you an "angry black man", this moment not withstanding? Probably not. Why should you willingly accept the stereotype? Many of us complained about the massive flow of hacked "manga" that Marvel was pumping out just a couple of years ago. It's not really here anymore. Why? We said no with our money. Do that here. Voice your dissent with your wallet. Say no to poor characterization and stereotypes with the almighty dollar. That's something that businessmen understand. While the characters of BP & Storm may not fit into the extreme with regards to stereotypes or cliches, some of their stories do. Put aside any love for the underlying story or the characters. Actually sit down and read this new "Storm" limited series. Apart from being a meandering piece of drivel, imho, it plays with so many tired cliches. If the writers really want the characters to grow then maybe this LS was a bad choice. It does nothing except reinforce bad writing. Nevermind that it's rehashed. Quote:
That's not to insult your intelligence, but it should be rather evident that this "event" is manufactured with sales in mind. Putting aside that everything in comics is manufactured, this storyline is rushed. It is the ultimate retcon. The history between the two has never been allowed to blossom organically. Re-read the BP/X-Men crossover from last year. That was so bad words cannot describe. The "Uncanny X-Men" annual is only slightly better. The "Storm" LS... Burn it. Want a perfect, modern example of a union that makes sense? How about the marriage of Luke Cage & Jessica Jones? Granted, both characters are not perfectly utilized nor are they exactly ripped from a Norman Rockwell painting. However, marriage for those two characters makes sense. Did we see the same level of hoopla as with Storm/BP? Nope. Should we have? Maybe. As disfunctional as those two are, their union/love feels much more real and far less contrived. Marvel can keep their Storm/BP wedding. You may find the story to be well executed, but yours isn't the only opinion. My intention was never to take a poke at you or any other person of color. I was merely looking at the broader perspective. Comics are a snapshot of our society. Rather, they are a snapshot of our society filtered by those in charge of that medium. Can we get away with the old "Slap a Jap" stuff of Action Comics #58 today? Not to the same exact degree, but yeah. Comic writers still do get away with stuff like that. They just fly a bit more under the radar. The insults are a bit more subtle and occasionally more insidious. Will comics look like this in 20 years? Assuming that they're still around, probably not. We'll grow past these mistakes and make all new ones. Such is the way of life, society, and progress. Last edited by cookepuss : 07-01-2006 at 11:10 AM. |
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07-01-2006, 02:06 PM
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#14 | |
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LOL! That was great! Hahahaha! |
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07-01-2006, 03:08 PM
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#15 |
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Somebody responded to me in private. I won't say who, but he was in relative agreement with me. I appreciate that. Thanks for your support. It's kind of hard to post in a thread like this without tempers boiling over. I'm not saying that I'm right or anything like that, but it feels good to know that I'm not alone. I certainly don't consider myself a racist. I hope that's not the way I sounded either. I'm being sincere here.
Not really OT, though it'll seem so at first.... Anybody here watch WWE Wrestling? Okay, it's fun to watch idiots beat the snot out of each other. Most comic readers enjoy a good slugfest. I know I do. Have you ever taken time to look at the actual characters? The late Eddie Guerrero... He lies, cheats, & steals. JBL... So right wing that he physically forces illegal aliens back over the border. Finlay... The fighting Irishman, complete with lephrechaun sidekick. Jamie Noble... WASPy trailer trash. Nunzio... Short, angry, machismo filled Italian Mark Henry... The angry black man. The Mexicools... They ride in on lawnmowers. ETC... ETC... ETC... The list goes on. Taken as a whole, most of us would probably wonder how this show has avoided condemnation by the NAACP - much in the same way as the aforementioned "Amos & Andy". Frankly, I'm surprised that good ole Vince hasn't run into more trouble with regards to racial/ethnic stereotypes. If you all aren't offended by at least one of the WWE stereotypes then I'd be surprised. How does this relate to comics? Comic writers & editors play the same exact game. Need a Japanese character? Somewhere along the line, you have to toss in stuff about honor, organized crime, or ninjas. Need a black character? He might not always be angry, but you're nearly always going to find the gritty "street" angle played up. Need an Irishman or Scott? Toss in a thick accent, add a healthy dose of religion, bravado, and the occasional bottle. Mix. Need a person from China? Gotta have the communist angle. The list goes on here too. It's no less shocking really. In a way, it's rather funny. Comics try so hard to be all-inclusive that they bungle the core elements of character. Obviously, if you're in this thread then you must at least have a passing fancy for the X-types. It's kinda sad the way Marvel has handled their characters in the past 10 years or so. Siryn... Angry booze hound. Rictor... Revealed to be Hispanic. Gained an accent. Lost it just as quickly. Wolfsbane... Started off as the God fearing Scott with the thick accent. Weir ditched the accent & integrated her. David reverted her to type. Warpath... Angry/proud feather wearing Native American who became less angry and less feather wearing. Reverted to type. Falcon... The prototype for the well adjusted black man. If anybody ever lets Bendis near him again... Grrrr  Storm... Not a problem with them delving into her history in Africa. Kind of disappointing that they'd let it take priority over everything she's experienced elsewhere. This brings me back around to the marriage. As a character, Black Panther kicks @$$. He's always been one of my faves. Regal. Intelligent. Wealthy. No nonsense. Just about everything you'd look for in a daytime soap leading man. He's an awesome character. Not sure if Hudlin is exactly the best man for the job, but that's neither here nor there.As a character, Storm kicks even more @$$. Intelligent. Trustworthy. Refined. Regal. Heck, she's so regal that she even captured the interest of Loki. Why is it that it bothers me that these two should be married off? It's probably because it feels like a corporate merger than a marriage. It feels as if Marvel's shoehorning her into a mold that she might not have previously fit, at least not completely. (See? I brought both of my points together. Sort of )DrCool976 brings up the point about them having a romantic history. He's got a point. HOWEVER, that history is an ex post facto sort of deal. Would any of you have thought of marrying off BP to Storm if Marvel didn't mentioned it? Would it have made sense to do so if they hadn't pulled a mondo retcon and manufacture this "rich romantic history"? Probably not. Your first thought might've been "Storm & Forge 4ever". Old school Marvel zombies make certain associations with regards to couples. Ben & Alicia. Shulkie & Wyatt. Alex & Lorna. Piotr & Kitty. Maybe I'll get used to it in time. T'Challa & Ororo still sounds odd to me, even if it made total sense in Earth X. I hope that tying it all into Civil War makes more sense in practice than it does on paper. (Y'know what I mean.) DrCool976, I never intended to cause you any distress. I know that the whole "Amos & Andy" thing got you upset. I really do. Ever see that show, btw? It goes back to my point about the road to hell being paved with good intentions. Here you have a guy who's not your stereotypical 1950's housekeeper or janitor. He's a respectable business owner, which was big for the 50's. On paper, it was a show that attempted to be inclusive and pioneering. In practice, the writers managed to mess it up by dumbing it down and playing to bad dialogue, condecending behaviour, & formulaic story writing. Same thing with my point regarding various minorities in comics. 20 years from now, we'll look at the same types of mistakes being made. Not necessarily as blatant, but just as obvious. Comics are doing the same level & quality of characterization as WWE wrestling. That doesn't bode well for Storm/BP. That doesn't bode well for any up & coming "minority" character with a new book. Again, I'm sorry if this rubbed people the wrong way. I've got nothing more to say on the topic other than I hope that Hudlin & Co. prove me wrong by making this the best darn comic wedding since Spidey & MJ. Last edited by cookepuss : 07-01-2006 at 03:13 PM. |
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07-01-2006, 03:26 PM
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#16 |
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Shhhh stop mentioning Brazil you'll only mess it up for the rest of us.
http://king-mag.com/online/?p=294 |
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07-01-2006, 08:57 PM
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#17 |
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This seems like piss-poor planning on Marvel's part.
If Iron Man (and the heroes who have joined his side) are working for the government and have been given a directive to bring in heroes who are avoiding registration, then what does it say if they are mixing with them at the wedding? Yes, it won't be on U.S. soil so they don't have juresdiction ... and really, if the heroes have left U.S. soil, then it would seem they are not obligated to register at that point (up until they return). However, with them gone, doesn't it set up a situation where the government (and Iron Man's group) could make it next to impossible for them to get back into the United States? In other words, once they are out, unless they agree to register, it would be difficult for them to get back in (because S.H.I.E.L.D. could certainly use satellite tracking technology to follow them when they leave Wakanda and keep tabs on them as they make their way back toward the United States and at that point send out teams to intercept them once they get back within (or over) U.S. terroritorial waters.) Not to mention ... even if they want to be respectful of T'Challa and Ororo's nuptials ... if their sides are so dead-set against each other ... I don't see how they can stand together at the thing without it resulting in a major slugfest. Bad planning Marvel. |
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07-02-2006, 12:26 AM
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#18 | |
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No, there is virtually no history. ANy history was specifically recently created for this event specifically to make sense. In other words, the only way for it to be logical is to make up a "long" history on the spot-because it makes no sense |
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07-02-2006, 08:51 PM
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#19 |
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????
Did anyone else here notice the release date? May...um...it is July folks...think if you were releasing a press release you would be up on releasing the updated release date for the materials.
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07-02-2006, 09:12 PM
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#20 | |
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Here's an idea: you buy or don't buy whatever you want and I'll do the same. Meanwhile, please don't tell me what I should be supporting. That's my decision to make. |
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07-02-2006, 09:18 PM
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#21 |
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By all means. Feel free to support bad story telling. That's your right. Were it not for people supporting limp writing then creators such as Chuck Austen might not still have jobs. Kudos to you for your charity.
C'mon, everybody. Money burning party!!!! Wheeee!!! |
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07-02-2006, 09:24 PM
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#22 |
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I suppose one should feel kind of sorry for Reggie Hudlin. Here he is crafting this story line, and now he has to shoehorn a tie-in to the latest Marvel event into it. I suppose he may not mind it, but I'd be rather annoyed if I had to do something like this on a book I was writing.
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07-02-2006, 09:24 PM
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#23 | |
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And who, praytell, appointed you as the judge of what's "good" and "bad?" That's a subjective thing that varies from individual to individual. Should we all consult you before making a trip to the comic store? You have the right to like or not like whatever you want. You don't have the right to tell anybody what to like, buy, or support. |
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07-02-2006, 09:51 PM
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#24 |
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Next time, break the pills in half.
 j/kBuy what you want. Nobody's going to stop you. The good thing about opinions is that they're like @$$#0les. We all have them and they all stink. Your opinion is just as worthwhile as mine. Personally, I feel that the natures of this particular beast are ones of contrivance and retroactive continuity, all for the sake of monetary gain and nothing more. There's something to be said for artistic, creative integrity. That's something I've felt has been lacking in this storyline this far. That's why I stopped buying it. I'm not one of those fanboys that'll b**ch & moan about a book, yet still buy it. I'll put my money where my mouth is, even if I've got enough of it to burn on filler. In the end, it's just a frickin' comic book. It's not curing cancer or anything. If somebody gets this uptight and serious about 22 pages of paper then I shudder at the thought of what else might upset them. Life's too short. Do a little dance. Make a little love. Get down tonight. Wait a second. I don't have the right to tell you to do a little dance, much less ask you to make a little love. Sorry. Last edited by cookepuss : 07-02-2006 at 09:54 PM. |
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07-02-2006, 09:56 PM
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#25 | |
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