JOHNS & KOLINS ON ROGUE'S REVENGE CHANGE-UP

[MattBrady]

by Vaneta Rogers

When DC said Final Crisis would cover the whole of the DC universe, they weren't kidding.

As readers will see in next week's July solicitations from DC Comics (coming Monday, right here at Newsarama), the Rogues Revenge story announced by Geoff Johns and Scott Kolins back in January will now wear a Final Crisis banner. What was once named The Flash: Rogues Revenge is instead titled Final Crisis: Rogues Revenge, and the mini-series went from six issues starting in June to three oversized issues beginning in July.

Why the change? Can readers still expect a story about the beloved Rogues from the Johns/Kolins Flash run? And what does that new dead-looking Flash cover mean? Newsarama asked Johns and Kolins to come back and clarify.

Newsarama: OK, we talked about this series in length before. But now there’s an obvious change from The Flash: Rogues Revenge to Final Crisis: Rogues Revenge … what happened?

Geoff Johns: I’ve spent the last several months talking a lot with Grant [Morrison] and Dan [DiDio] about the DC Universe. Every time we spoke, things got bigger. Much bigger. Grant’s really doing his opus here with Final Crisis, and as I’ve said before, I get to ride shotgun.

As you can see on the cover of DC Universe #0, the Rogues will be some of the central figures in the events surrounding and taking place in Final Crisis, and Scott and I couldn’t be happier for it. The story of Rogues Revenge, the issues, the scope, the ramifications have all grown. The Rogues have been stepping in it all year, and they’re not going to catch a break. Poor guys.

Scott Kolins: And because of the Final Crisis format, now the format on our book is different and that made the issues a little bigger. So the series is now fewer issues, but bigger issues.

NRAMA: Each issue is going to be oversized, and there are three issues, correct?

GJ: Yep! And Scott is as fast as the Flash, so he’s already well into the series…

NRAMA: So does this tie directly into things that are going on in Final Crisis?

GJ: Yep. It starts in DC Universe #0. The Rogues have had a hell of a year. They're really tired of everything. And at the same time that we're doing this series, there's a new Secret Society forming. And the Rogues are resisting it.

NRAMA: Aaaah. So they're going to be rogue Rogues?

GJ: [laughs] Maybe. Maybe they’re the Rogues of the rogues.

NRAMA: For people who may not have read the last interview we did, can you tell us about the story you'll be telling in Rogues Revenge? This mini-series returns the two of you to characters for which you’re well known, right?

GJ: Scott and I worked really hard on the Rogues when we were working on The Flash. For us, they were a staple of our run, and the Rogues issues in particular. We love those characters. So revisiting them and looking at where they are and where the Flash universe is -- we wanted to explore these characters again. We wanted to see where they are after all this hell they've been through. What’s next for them? And what is their role in the Flash Universe and the DC Universe?

NRAMA: You say you wanted to see "where they are." So where are they as we pick up the series?

GJ: This is a group of guys who either consciously, purposely, or accidentally destroyed their own families, and the only real solace they've found in life, they've found amongst each other being these super-thugs and hiding behind these masks and costumes. And now they're at a point in their life where maybe it's time to give it up. Maybe it's time we quit this gig because it's gone bad. We broke the rules, we killed a Flash, and now we're paying the price. They're pretty damn tired.

SK: In the first scenes, it was extremely important story-wise and for me drawing it and getting back into the Rogues that I draw these Rogues like they have been through the mill. They are dirty, they're ripped, they're torn, they're bleeding. They've been through many, many bad days. They've been on the run since Bart's death. And now the Secret Society is putting the screws to them. Everywhere they turn, they're being beaten down. They’ve had it, and they’re not going to take it anymore.

GJ: Captain Cold's first line is, "I need a damn beer." And that kind of sums him up as we start the story.

SK: [laughs] The man just wants some refreshment!

NRAMA: This story also deals with the repercussions of them killing Bart Allen, right?

GJ: That’s central to the story. That's part of the hell they've been through lately. They were lured by Inertia into getting involved in this mess. Their first rule has always been to never kill a Flash, because they know what kind of heat that will bring down. They’re smarter than that…usually.

And the one thing that keeps them from getting out of the game initially is that there's a chance at revenge here. They have all this pain and frustration, and they have no one to take it out on.

NRAMA: But they still have rules?

GJ: Well, they're bad guys. They've killed before. But they do have rules about this that they try to follow. And when they don't follow the rules, that's when things go wrong. When Mirror Master steps out of line and goes anywhere near drugs, Captain Cold has to yank him back. When Heat Wave loses control of his pyromania, Captain Cold's got to yank him back. These guys have had their lives ripped apart in numerous ways.

NRAMA: Will we see you get into who these characters are and why they are, as you say, "ripped apart?"

GJ: We'll actually be getting into their psychosis a little bit deeper than we have before. You'll see a lot of Captain Cold – you’ll learn Weather Wizard’s dark secret – you’ll see a lot of familiar people to the Rogues and the Flash. We're going to get into the history of these guys and the people they were, and the people they are now. And we'll find out where they're going.

But it's really about how they've seen three generations of Flash come and go, and is it time to hang it up?

NRAMA: Now, wait. Looking at our last interview – and just to double-check – you guys said the two detectives you used during your Flash run, Morillo and Chyre, would be returning in these issues. Now that the name has changed, is that still true?

GJ: Yep.

NRAMA: And Pied Piper. You said he has a big role. Is that still true?

GJ: Yep. He's still a main character. Piper is one of our favorites. A reformed Rogue who, despite his best intentions, keeps getting dragged back in.

NRAMA: It sounds like the main beats are still there. But just to clarify... we've heard Dan talk about there being two limited series that go along with Final Crisis. You just told Newsarama readers last week how one of those is the five-issue series Final Crisis: Legion of 3 Worlds. Even though we're now finding out these three Rogues issues are under the Final Crisis umbrella, is there still another Final Crisis tie-in series to be announced?

GJ: Yes.

NRAMA: Another mini-series, right?

GJ: Yep. Anything with Final Crisis on it is limited. You're not going to have 80 books out there with Final Crisis on them. And we're following the same cover format and design as the other two Final Crisis limited series.

NRAMA: Let's talk about these covers. Scott, what can you tell us about them?

SK: We've come up with new covers to reflect the change. There are going to be two covers for each Final Crisis issue. A “sliver” cover relating to the content of the issue, like a pivotal scene, and an “iconic” cover spotlighting a main character in the issue. Our “sliver” cover for #1 is the death of a Flash – which is what the series is mostly about. It’s the driving force of this series. A Flash was murdered!

NRAMA: Yeah, but ... there's a dying Flash, and the word Crisis is going to be on the cover. That's bound to raise some questions, even if it does focus on the death of Bart Allen. Can you tell us why you chose this dying Flash image as the new cover, Geoff?

GJ: Draw your own conclusions.

NRAMA: OK... then the other cover...

SK: The “iconic” cover for #1 is obvious -- if you're going to do a book about the Rogues, the first one you're going to do is Captain Cold. The second one…draw your own conclusions.

NRAMA: Many self-drawn conclusions will immediately follow this interview, so it's good to hear you invite them. Is there anything else you want to tell anxious readers?

GJ: The Rogues are back.

SK: God help the Flash.

NRAMA: Oh, man. Then, since you've opened the door to all this Flash talk... this last question is for you, Geoff. Now that this series is tied into Final Crisis, does Rogues Revenge have anything to do with the Lightning Rod that you said is going to be part of your Final Crisis: Legion of 3 Worlds story?

GJ: You know I can’t answer that. But yes.

[TheMadMonk]

This sounds interesting. The Rogues have always been a bit outside the Society. Sounds like they will be up against everybody.

Yeah, I finnaly got a first post!

[Kalel638]

Litghnind rod? LSH? now I got to get both series!

[transmetro]

This sounds great. The ongoing Flash title has been terrible since his rogue gallery left. More then likely i'll be cutting the flash title, but i'll be picking this up. And besides, Johns can do no wrong.

[Lex]

I'm less excited about this mini than I was before. It should've stayed as a self-contained story.

[DaVeO]

Originally Posted by Kalel638

Litghnind rod? LSH? now I got to get both series!

Geoff lured you with the lightning rod as he would a fish with a fishing rod.

[Moriarty]

Originally Posted by Lex

I'm less excited about this mini than I was before. It should've stayed as a self-contained story.

If anything, I'm more excited now (and even more anxious to pick up the rest of Johns' Flash trades).

[Heatwave]

Count me in! This is going to be the best thing DC produces this year. I'm 110 percent on board.

[cap infinity]

I miss Trickster.

[nietoperz]

I really hope Wally's not getting bumped off. I also hope Barry's not coming back.

[CometSweat84]

Hmm, didn't DiDio claim that he was going to make sure the Final Crisis tie-ins were going to be at a minimum? I know Rogues' Revenge is it's own story all together, but this seems like the practice DC overused by slapping "Countdown" on everything...

[Punchy]

Good to see DC has an interesting idea about cover layout, Civil War's trade dress really helped it and it's numerous tie-ins stand out, and the sliver notion should hopefully do that too.

[Heatwave]

I hope that DC uses this opportunity to finally return the greatest Flash of them all...
BARRY ALLEN.

[Poe]

Really looking forward to this. Should be great fun. Geoff Johns is my favorite writer currently, and Scott Kolins ain't no slouch either.

[Clem]

I hate when companies start adding silly prefixes to titles in the hopes it'll sell more. It's like "52 Aftermath: Crime Bible: Five Lessons...", when infact it should've been "The Question: Five Lessons...".

Call me strange, but a Rogues story should have "The Flash" at the front and the Legion should be "The Legion...".

[Poe]

Originally Posted by Clem

I hate when companies start adding silly prefixes to titles in the hopes it'll sell more. It's like "52 Aftermath: Crime Bible: Five Lessons...", when infact it should've been "The Question: Five Lessons...".

Call me strange, but a Rogues story should have "The Flash" at the front and the Legion should be "The Legion...".

I agree to a point. I realize its done to sell more books, and it very well may attract more attention and readers/buyers because it is a Final Crisis tie-in, but I like the title "The Flash: Rogues Revenge" better, just because it sounds more...I dunno, Flash oriented. I know that sounds silly, possibly even stupid, but there you have it.

[Poe]

Originally Posted by Heatwave

I hope that DC uses this opportunity to finally return the greatest Flash of them all...
BARRY ALLEN.

I tend to think its going to be Bart instead of Barry, mainly because his time as the "official" Flash was so short and because he's originally from the 30th Century and has shown to be impervious to changes in the timeline. I wouldn't be surprised to see a new "The Flash and the Legion of Super-Heroes" title launched.

[Lupek]

Originally Posted by Heatwave

I hope that DC uses this opportunity to finally return the greatest Flash of them all...
BARRY ALLEN.

What he said!!!

[KirkWarren]

Secret Society is reforming...again. When should we care about that if it happens every 6 months?

I hope the Rogue's story actually warrants the Final Crisis moniker and hasn't been simply upgraded for the sake of another tie-in.

[munniec]

Originally Posted by CometSweat84

Hmm, didn't DiDio claim that he was going to make sure the Final Crisis tie-ins were going to be at a minimum? I know Rogues' Revenge is it's own story all together, but this seems like the practice DC overused by slapping "Countdown" on everything...

Did you read the article? He said that there was one more mini-series to be announced and that everything to do with Crisis is a limited series. Right now there's just 3 minis, not that big of a deal

[God-Man]

I'll pretty much buy anything named Final Crisis. Especially if Geoff Johns is involved.

[pastorfrank]

Geoff Johns: awesome
Rogues Gallery: incredible
Scott Kolins: blah!

I have never liked Kolins work - still don't.

[CometSweat84]

Originally Posted by munniec

Did you read the article? He said that there was one more mini-series to be announced and that everything to do with Crisis is a limited series. Right now there's just 3 minis, not that big of a deal

Yes, but the point is that it originally didn't have Final Crisis attached to it. Granted, Johns does admit that the events in his mini do tie in with Morrison's mini, but the fact does remain that DiDio said he wasn't going to be so free with slapping the Final Crisis title on random books. Like with Countdown to Mystery--what did that series have to really do with the Countdown weekly? Sure, Eclipso was in the weekly for a bit, but it was the Jean Loring version--the Mystery series has been focusing on the new Bruce Gordon taking on the role without any direct connection to the weekly at all.

[Corpulent1]

As much as I love Kolins' art, whether I buy this will depend on how DC Universe #0 is. I'm trying to avoid as much Final Crisis-related stuff as I can, but Johns and Kolins returning to the Rogues makes this tough to pass on.

[grantg]

Here's what I think in terms of the Flash and Final Crisis:

Barry is coming back.
Wally will retire to the future with his family
Bart will come back as Kid Flash (or Impulse.) We'll find out that the Bart that 'died' was from Earth-15.
Jay will... do nothing. Maybe throw his hat.

So, we'll have Barry and Bart running around in the Flash title. Barry in JLA. Bart in Teen Titans. Wally in the future. And Jay in JSA.

Sure, I think it's lame to bring back Barry, but what choice does DC have? Flash has been a cluster **** since IC. They can't make Jay THE Flash again, Wally is saddled with the two kids and Bart was aged and then killed.

Barry is their only hope.