RON GARNEY: TALKING BLACK

[MattBrady]

by Vaneta Rogers

Beginning this month, Spider-Man is back in black.

Readers have been anticipating this event -- their love and nostalgia for the black costume driving their excitement -- and wondering what motivates the webslinger to don the black costume again.

In issue #539 of Amazing Spider-Man, they found out.

A sniper hired by the Kingpin to take out Peter Parker and his family has succeeded in shooting his aunt, May Parker. As she lies in a hospital bed near death, a rage-filled Peter is out busting heads and taking names.

And when he's intent on doing the dirty work of revenge, Spider-Man decides to make a fashion statement.

Ron Garney, the penciller on Amazing Spider-Man for writer J. Michael Straczynski since Issue #529, has also been anticipating the return to black. The artist shared some of his sketches for the storyline with Newsarama and sat down to talk about what it's like to draw an emotional Peter Parker in the iconic black costume.

Newsarama: Let's talk about what's been leading up to the Back in Black storyline. Coming into this, with Civil War and his unmasking, Peter's been through a lot. What was it like drawing all that?

Ron Garney: What was it like drawing him becoming angry?

NRAMA: Well, he's hasn't been really angry until this last issue, has he? He kind of had a passive, trusting thing going on last year, then fear and indecision, determination -- all kinds of changes over the course of a year.

RG: Yeah, yeah. That's true. And I think it's great. We all go through our changes and our particular moods and attitudes and angst. We go through it in waves, and it makes it more real to see these emotions and how these things affect this person and how he's dealing with them. The thing for me is expressing that on this person's face. When I'm drawing him, I'm really creating this actor on this piece of paper that has to convey all of these things. It's fun really. You kind of act it out yourself in some weird way, you know?

NRAMA: Well, in the first page of the Back in Black storyline in Amazing, issue #539, which came out last week, Peter's holding Aunt May and has a real look of innocent surprise on his face. But you look at the next page where he says, "No ... no more," and it's not the same emotion at all. He's so filled with anger in that next panel. It's as if something snaps.

RG: Yeah, he definitely snaps. You know, the guy's been through so much. I don't know what it would be like to live through this stuff. First of all, he has spider powers, so you have to take that out of the equation for a second. But if you were constantly confronted with the nagging possibility that somebody you really care about is under attack by people who want to get to you -- I just think over time it's going to make you snap. And I think he finally does.

NRAMA: It's tough to watch. I mean, he even says "no rules," you know? He's so ticked off he throws a Jeep, then later he just goes off on some guys and breaks one guy's hand without even pausing.

RG: Yeah, for the reader, it's kind of jarring because you see him use his power through his anger. And it's kind of disconcerting. It's an uncomfortable thing to see in some ways. You know, I just saw this video on the internet of this cop in Chicago in this bar, and he beats the crap out of this bartender. Now, you can't compare Peter Parker with this idiot, but I was thinking about that today and just how people do snap. And what an uncomfortable thing that is to see. We take it for granted -- we watch the Ultimate Fighting championship or whatever and see violence in what's going on with the war and stuff -- but it's never a comfortable feeling. And I think to see Spider-Man go into this whole other place that we didn't really know he was capable of is quite interesting.

NRAMA: That's the whole basis for the black costume, right? He's in this "other place." One of anger.

RG: Yeah. I think people may expect you're going to go into some Freudian novel, but really, you don't need all that to get the impact of just simple anger that somebody would go through in a situation like this.

NRAMA: Last time we talked, you were pretty excited about the prospect of getting to draw the black costume because it's such an iconic part of Spider-Man's lore. What's it been like to actually get to do it?

RG: It's great because it's like the visual matched what's going on. It's a more deliberate theme running through the whole book. The black costume represents that. It's a much creepier, uncomfortable look. I mean, it's funny when I see other versions of the costume by other artists, depending on their particular style, the one thing that's consistent is that the black costume still feels -- even if it's somebody who draws in a cartoon-y fashion -- that costume still feels a little more edgy, you know? And darker. It works great for this storyline.

NRAMA: It's a visual reflection of his mood.

RG: Yeah, we could have kept him in the red and blue, and he still would have been angry, and it still would have been a great story. But just the visual of that black and white works with the black and white harshness of that anger, if that makes sense.

NRAMA: Well, yeah. Heroes deal with gray areas all the time, but Peter's head isn't there. It's very black and white for him when he's functioning through this anger. But moving away from the psychological aspects of the character here, Ron, let's talk about how you draw this. Is it difficult to draw the black costume?

RG: It's not harder. The trick is to find places to put shadows, because understanding where the colorist is going -- what he's going to do with it. If you put too much light on it, it's not black. I mean, too many highlights from above or underneath is going to become more blue-ish. So it's kind of tricky to figure out where ... to stop the black bleeding all over the costume and where to put the light.

But you know, anything's easier than having to draw all those webs. Getting those symmetrical and just right and having the webbing run around the red of the costume -- that's tough. It takes some getting used to.

NRAMA: Had you drawn Spider-Man in his black costume before -- in a published comic?

RG: Only in my wondrous imagination. [laughs] I don't think I've ever drawn him in a book. Wait a minute ... I have. I did it back in '91 or something. I had him in Moon Knight for a bunch of issues, and he was in the black costume fighting the Hobgoblin, actually. Yeah. So I have drawn him in the black.

NRAMA: Are you doing a better job now?

RG: [laughs] Oh, yeah! I'm not going to tell you to go pick those issues up. But yeah, definitely, my draftsmanship has gotten so much better over the years. I don't even think a lot of people realize I did those issues way back then. People tend to remember me coming right on Captain America. But I was in the business for five or six years before that and did titles like that.

NRAMA: In the next few issues of Amazing, is there anything in particular that was a challenge for you to draw?

There's not anything challenging, per se, as far as any degree of difficulty. It's pretty self-explanatory. He's angry. He's pissed off. And the story unfolds from there. It's all about trying to convey -- because there are all degrees of anger -- but trying to convey the emotions on the faces that is the most challenging part. It's a lot harder than people realize to get a point across visually without words, just showing emotion on a face. And with the black costume, with just eyes and everything, I've had to rely on body language. But yeah, the facial expressions have been the most challenging.

NRAMA: I've heard that before about characters in masks -- that their body language has to speak to their emotions. How has Peter's body language changed with this anger?

RG: I have to convey a tenseness that his anger would bring. How hard are his fists clenched? Is he gritting his teeth? It doesn't seem like it when you just look at it, but those things make a difference in his body language.

NRAMA: You know, you just mentioned how you drew Captain America for awhile. It's something for which you're recognized, even now. And he's dead! What do you think?

RG: [laughs] Yeah. He's dead.

You know, I think it's sort of ... because of who Cap is and what he represents, I think it's sort of a sign of the times. It's sort of a metaphor for the kind of guy who isn't in our particular media driven world, and his values aren't necessarily -- you know, everything's such a gray area in this country now as opposed to World War II. The positions of right and wrong have become so skewed. So I think Cap is more of a black and white guy -- no pun intended with this interview. But he's got more of a black and white, traditional point of view, and I think now everybody has their perception and perspective on things and they try to be more liberal about all the different sides -- "Can you see it from this side? Can't you understand and be more empathic?" I'm not saying Cap wasn't an empathic character. But I do think his death kind of represents something more.

NRAMA: You laughed when I first asked the question.

RG: My personal opinion is that he'll be back. But I don't know.

NRAMA: Apart from your work on Amazing, you've dabbled in some movie
stuff lately, right?

RG: Yeah, not much. But I've done some work for a Will Smith vehicle called I Am Legend. It's a remake of a movie that Charlton Heston did -- the book was called I Am Legend, but the movie that Heston did later was The Omega Man. It's a remake of that, and they've taken the script much more seriously, I think.

I'm doing costume illustration and some art direction. I haven't done a lot. In my spare time, working for Marvel, I've done some sketches for costume illustration.

NRAMA: You got to meet Will Smith, right?

RG: Yes, I did. It was fun. I was on the set and got to meet him and the director, Francis Lawrence, who also did Constantine. And working with Michael Kaplan, the costume designer, has been a great experience because he's done some of my favorite movies. He's done Fight Club and Se7en and Blade Runner, so he's a pretty talented guy
and very well known.

NRAMA: So what's next for you? We know J. Michael Straczynski is leaving Amazing Spider-Man later this year.

RG: Well, I think it's already out that Phil Jimenez is doing an extended arc, and some changes are happening, and I'm not at liberty to reveal them. Only Marvel can do that. So, it's possible I may continue doing some Amazing, but there are other things we've talked about. We're in the process of working all that out.

NRAMA: Can you give us any kind of information on what fans can expect over the next few issues of Amazing Spider-Man?

RG: Well, the art I'm working on as we're speaking ... Peter's pulling a sheet over a corpse. [laughs] I know the fans have probably had their fill of that kind of teasing with Aunt May and all, but be warned: There's more to come.

[Awake1313]

Loved it when Peter threw the truck into the building. F'n sweetness...

[CrankyViking]

Keep it up, Ron. We'll keep buying.

[PHEEL]

Looks like this can be quite interesting. Love some of the preview visuals.

[BornToRun]

I recently found my old "Rough Cut" of Cap: Sentinel of Liberty #1 by Waid & Garney and was surprised by the starkness and strength of his un-inked pencils. These pieces are terrific. If nothing else, it gives me the feel that maybe Marvel's look is a little "too" finished for Garney and that he needs to find either an indie or a Vertigo book or something that would allow him to really flourish.

[Somebody]

Originally Posted by MattBrady

They should have printed the cover like that, instead of the overrendered mess it ended up as...

[Heffaloo]

Originally Posted by Somebody

They should have printed the cover like that, instead of the overrendered mess it ended up as...

I was thinking something similar (not quite as harshly about the actual cover they used). I really like this image. It reminds me of the "Life in the Mad Dog Ward" covers. I liked those.

[shizumadrive]

Spidey was close to Cap too. They should have tied this in away. Since his aunt and friend both got snipered.

[RTommyB216]

Originally Posted by Somebody

They should have printed the cover like that, instead of the overrendered mess it ended up as...

I loved the finished cover

[kalorama]

Originally Posted by BornToRun

I recently found my old "Rough Cut" of Cap: Sentinel of Liberty #1 by Waid & Garney and was surprised by the starkness and strength of his un-inked pencils. These pieces are terrific. If nothing else, it gives me the feel that maybe Marvel's look is a little "too" finished for Garney and that he needs to find either an indie or a Vertigo book or something that would allow him to really flourish.

Some pencillers are more "inker sensitive" than others. Garney's pencils have a fluidity and power that is most often lacking in his inked work, even when he's inked by good renderers. Aside from bob Wiacek, I really think Garney's done the best job of inking his pencils himself (on JLA). The finished product wasn't as slick or clean as with other inkers, but there was a (for lack of a better term) purity to the art that really made it work.

[Tarfang]

soooo...web fluid dissolves after a while right? how come his black costume was webbed to a building and the webbing hadn't dissolved yet? picky picky...

also, will smith's I AM LEGEND is going to SUCK...anyone who has actually read the book will attest that the OMEGA MAN is not a very good adaptation, and actually goes off in a whole different direction than the book. They should have just called this new one the OMEGA MAN, and not I AM LEGEND. Matheson is rolling in his grave....

THATS ENOUGH, WILL SMITH...!

[JoeGKushner]

RG: Yeah, not much. But I've done some work for a Will Smith vehicle called I Am Legend. It's a remake of a movie that Charlton Heston did -- the book was called I Am Legend, but the movie that Heston did later was The Omega Man. It's a remake of that, and they've taken the script much more seriously, I think.

The Omega Man is the second remake of the book, the Vincent Price Movie, "Last Man on Earth", also based on the old Richard Matthews book, "I Am Legend."

[Charlie Hustle]

Originally Posted by Somebody

They should have printed the cover like that, instead of the overrendered mess it ended up as...

It wasn't a mess

[Lord Jason]

I think Garney’s work is top drawer. He’s like an old style illustrator, no fancy gimmicks or over-stylised work, just solid, loose and light work – not over-inked or detailed to the hilt. And very, very fluid. Great to see it in a top-selling book.

While I started collecting Spidey titles during Romita Jr’s run and being a big fan of Jr Jr, Garney’s work is really giving me a feel for those Ron Frenz years when I was a kid collecting UK reprints - back when Spider-Man wore black.

And reading the tie-ins handled by Garney made Civil War a little more bearable.

[Dragavon]

Originally Posted by Tarfang

soooo...web fluid dissolves after a while right? how come his black costume was webbed to a building and the webbing hadn't dissolved yet? picky picky

Most of Spidey's webbing dissolved in an hour because he set the chemical composition that way. He also had webbing that never dissolved, which is what he must have used for storing the black costume.

[Hand213]

Originally Posted by Somebody

They should have printed the cover like that, instead of the overrendered mess it ended up as...

I definitely dig the starkness and the bareness of this cover, but what the finished version provides, I think, is those hints of blue and red that really serve to emphasize how the black costume is being overlaid on the orginal, essentially eclipsing it.

[MurrayC]

Originally Posted by Somebody

They should have printed the cover like that, instead of the overrendered mess it ended up as...

Chances you will get your wish because no doubt this issue will sell out, and they will do a second print with a "variant sketch cover"

[VortexSurfer]

Originally Posted by shizumadrive

Spidey was close to Cap too. They should have tied this in away. Since his aunt and friend both got snipered.

I think they´ll do.
The current issue(s) take place right after CW #7, so Cap´s death is still to come.
I liked it. Nothing sensational, but ok.

[protonik]

I think this is before the sniper got to Cap but aside from that what I like about Ron's work is that it is a return to old school Spidey and not the dark, spooky art of Deodato or the overly cartoony art that has been on the peripheral books since JRjr left. I can not wait until JRjr comes back and I hope Garney stays on Spidey and then we have Campbell (which is more like McFarlane than the cartoony guys). Friendly needs a regular, regular artist, not a rotating art team that alternates issues.

[RDuarte]

Originally Posted by Tarfang

soooo...web fluid dissolves after a while right? how come his black costume was webbed to a building and the webbing hadn't dissolved yet? picky picky...

Much like the button pushing guy on LOST, Spidey would swing by every hour and re-web it.

Seriously, it's a comic book. The guy got bitten by a radioactive spider. And he was a semi-professional wrestler. And his best friend's dad happened to be his arch nemesis. Before his best friend became his arch nemesis. Then his best friend's dad died. Then his best friend died. Then his best friend's dad came back to life. And his aunt almost married another one of his arch nemeses, a guy who happens to be named Octavius, and who just happened to get four mechanical "octopus-like" arms grafted onto his body. And he married a super model. And he went into space and found an alien symbiote that basically tried to eat him. And the symbiote became another one of his arch nemeses. And that's just the basics...

You can believe all that, but you can't stand his webbing not dissolving in an hour? Just make up a solution and send it in for a no-prize! That's what a TRUE nit-picky Marvel fan would have done, not posting their nit-pick on a message board somewhere.

[macwagen]

This past issue had me so geeked I can't even begin to tell you...the way Ron conveyed Peter's rage was brilliant. I've waited a loooong time to see Spider-Man really cut loose, and it looks like the worth was well worth it. I sped through the book on my first read because I just had to see what was going to happen next, but I poured over the book a solid three or four times just to soak in the magnificent artwork. I'm hoping that when JMS' run comes to an end, Ron will stay on the book for a long time.

[PSoares]

Great interview! Ron Garney is quickly becoming one of my favorite Spidey's artists! Keep it up Ron and congratulations!

[darrenmdr]

Originally Posted by RDuarte

Much like the button pushing guy on LOST, Spidey would swing by every hour and re-web it.

Seriously, it's a comic book. The guy got bitten by a radioactive spider. And he was a semi-professional wrestler. And his best friend's dad happened to be his arch nemesis. Before his best friend became his arch nemesis. Then his best friend's dad died. Then his best friend died. Then his best friend's dad came back to life. And his aunt almost married another one of his arch nemeses, a guy who happens to be named Octavius, and who just happened to get four mechanical "octopus-like" arms grafted onto his body. And he married a super model. And he went into space and found an alien symbiote that basically tried to eat him. And the symbiote became another one of his arch nemeses. And that's just the basics...

You can believe all that, but you can't stand his webbing not dissolving in an hour? Just make up a solution and send it in for a no-prize! That's what a TRUE nit-picky Marvel fan would have done, not posting their nit-pick on a message board somewhere.

Ha Ha well said.

[Kenro]

Ron still draws my favorite version of the Surfer.

[CATMAN3]

Originally Posted by Somebody

They should have printed the cover like that, instead of the overrendered mess it ended up as...

Maybe they'll use it for a 2nd print cover.