This is an open letter / appeal to comic fans.

[daveys]

This is an open letter / appeal to comic fans.

The current generation, which is growing up with the Internet, has come to feel that downloading music, movies, books and now comics is acceptable. It is not. In the case of comics, it is a small medium and any lost sales can mean the difference between a
comic series succeeding or failing. Furthermore, these are real people who are effected by these lost sales. These are not multi-national, faceless corporations making billions of dollars each year, these are little people like you and me, who are just
fortunate enough to be able to do what they love.

Feeding into the problem that everything on the internet is free is that copyright law was not written with the Internet in mind. BitTorrent sites are able to exist on the edge the copyright law by not actually hosting copyright material but instead hosting 'torrent' files, making it possible for people to download copyright material from hundreds of other people. This creates a problem for companies who own the copyright material, and
the law enforcement bodies who try to protect their rights, by making it next to impossible to stop it due to the sheer number of people taking part.

In the last week, I have been investigating the largest BitTorrent feed for pirated comics, ZcultFM.com. ZcultFM.com hosts the torrent files that allow people to download comics that other people have scanned in.

This is what my open letter / appeal to you is about. As I explain aspects of how ZcultFm.com works, I will include email addresses, giving you the opportunity to help prevent the copyright infringement of comics by emailing the ISP.

In each case, I have already emailed the ISP the following:
"Hi, You are hosting a BitTorrent "tracker" for a website called
zcultfm.com, which is distributing copyright material (comic books). In the best in terest of the people who
created those comics and are losing out on income, due to their illegal distribution via zcultfm.com, please discontinue providing service. Thank you."

Unfortunately, I have gotten no where. In one case, the ISP acknowledged that it was their IP address and that they knew that the site was hosting torrent files but if I could not give them proof of them actually "hosting" copyright material they would do
nothing about it. I would have to provide a direct link or no action would be taken.

That is where you come in. It is my hope that, if enough people start to write emails, the ISP will do something, in spite of the fact that current copyright law does not legally
compel them do something.

Who / what is ZcultFM.com? ZcultFM.com is run by a person who goes by the alias 'Serj'. His real name is Ian. I was able to get his real name, address and birthdate from his Paypal account, which he has so that he can receive money from people
who use ZcultFM.com. Not only is Ian, via ZcultFM.com, aiding copyright infringement, but he is profiting from it. What degree of income he earns from that site is unknown but there are hundreds of people who have "donated". You don't have to donate to his site to get the information and I do not have an email address for you to contact Paypal, but you can communicate any concerns directly when you are using your Paypal account.

The website ZcultFM.com (OrgName: Savvis - Email: abuse@savvis.net) is where the 9,000+ users interact via forums and private messages. It used to have 17,000 members listed but Ian removed all user accounts where
the person hadn't either posted a message to the forums or donated to his Paypal account. Therefore, it is reasonable to believe that all 9,000+ users are real people.

ZcultFM.com feeds torrent files to people via 4 trackers that you can get access to via the website:
1) tracker1.zcultfm.com - netname: BT-CENTRAL - email: abuse@btbroadband.com
2) tracker2.zcultfm.com - netname: Netvision - email: abuse@netvision.net.il
3) tracker3.zcultfm.com - netname: Videotron - email: abuse@videotron.ca
4) tracker4.zcultfm.com - netname: BellGlobal - email: abuse@bellnexxia.net

These trackers are hosted by different ISP's and are financially supported by people other than Ian. In each case, the tracker does not host copyright material and has the following
disclaimer when you go to the corresponding website: "Disclaimer: This site contains no copyrighted comic materials and only functions as a repository for the exchange of
".torrent" files. For more information on the function and content of ".torrent" files" You can check out any of the above websites by merely typing the address into your web browser and adding ':6969' at the end.

In addition to BitTorrent torrent files. ZcultFM.com hosts a DC++ Hub. DC++ is yet another P2P type network. Their DC++ Hub can be accessed at Cult-FM.no-ip.org:1599
( OrgName: Savvis - Email: abuse@savvis.net) by any DC++ client. At any moment in time there are 500+ people connected to it sharing comic files.

This is not a personal attack on Ian, which is why I haven't included his last name or where he lives, this is trying to protect the comic medium. This medium is not healthy, and it hasn't been healthy since the early 90's. Although comic related movies have
helped, comics sales are suffering and ZcultFM.com does not help. It is not the sharing of older comics that is the problem either. It is the existances of 0Day comics. These are comics that are made available to people online (illegally) the same day the
come out on comic store shelves. These are real lost sales to the comic companies and creators.

I hope you take the time to contact the ISP's above via the abuse email addresses.

Thank you.

For further reading on the subject of comic piracy, please see the following:

The Scurvy Dogs of Comics Piracy

Slashdot Are We About To Enter The Age of Book Piracy?

NinthArt Understanding [Comic] Piracy

SBC File-Sharing Comics - Good/Bad/Indifferent?

TCJ Echoes of Napster, Part I (Comics and the Internet)
TCJ Echoes of Napster, Part II (Comics and the Internet)
TCJ Echoes of Napster, Part III (Comics and the Internet)

Cinescape BitTorrent - the new wave of comic swapping, or on-line piracy?

[Winteriscoming]

Wow, you put in a lot of hard work. Personaly I have never downloaded a comic off the net. Hopefuly those who do will think twice in future.

[skywatcher]

Originally posted by daveys
I hope you take the time to contact the ISP's above via the abuse email addresses.

Shouldn't Marvel or DC's legal departments be doing this? That is what they are paid for. Sorry, Davey's but it's too much trouble for me. I will say that I don't download anything myself, as I regard that as theft.

[Kolimar]

Originally posted by skywatcher
Shouldn't Marvel or DC's legal departments be doing this? That is what they are paid for. Sorry, Davey's but it's too much trouble for me. I will say that I don't download anything myself, as I regard that as theft.

Yep.

[bob_at_york]

Never downloaded a comic before. The thought never even crossed my mind.

[cncoyle]

Originally posted by Kolimar
Yep.

Yup.

Mmm-hmm.

[Jamie Coville]

I just recently did a survey on comic book downloaders and scanners. It covers buying habits, among other things. Here is the URL:

http://www.thecomicbooks.com/misc/surveyresults.html

[comic_dealer]

Obviously, Mr. Stephenson doesn't have a firm grasp on how retailing in the comics industry or any other industry works!

For comics, unless you are dealing with a smaller company that has no distribution set-up with a company, you never ever buy from the company.

90% of all comic dealers on the North American continent purchase their books from a middle man, namely "Diamond Comics". Diamond Comics is a distributor for the larger companies, an independent entity.

When a dealer orders his books from Diamond, Diamond has already placed and paid for an order from the companies.

The dealer then pays the distributor for the books. Who has already paid the companies for the books.

Creators are already paid by the companies who have made their profit from sales to the distributors.

By the time you purchase a book from a dealer, it has, essentially been paid for TWICE!

The only person who really loses out from piracy is the local dealer, and having talked to quite a few dealers personally, sales
have not been hit or taken a dive due to piracy. If anything, because people have been able to read a book before buying, it has helped to make sales that may have not been made before.

Today's market is filled with fickle purchasers, and because of that, the dealer's "word" is not worth as much as it used to be. Nowadays, the "word" can be used to move product that doesn't sell. Not due to piracy, mind you, but the companies that produce the book assigning sub-standard art or writers.

With the secondary market as well..
When you buy a back issue, that issue itself has gone through that first process, with an additional process of the dealer buying it from another customer... again, the companies face no loss, because the book has already been paid for.

It's very possible that Mr. Stephenson has an agenda for the industry and Z-Cult in specific, but in the end, his arguement has no merit as it contradicts how the market works, and I said above, it just shows that he has the air of a hero looking for a maiden in distress, and finding that they are none, builds up an imaginary one.

[jza1218]

Two first-time posters enter...none shall leave...Rated R...Starring Mel Gibson...

Welcome to the boards!!!

[Bakema NL]

I downloaded like nobody's business, music and games. No movies, quality sucked too often and it never crossed my mind there were comics out there............but a scanned comic sucks even more. But sometime later I stopped the downloading, it just sucks totally. I don't like the copies and don't see them as part of my collection. Whenever I had to choose a new game I always went for the ones I paid for, not the copies. Music likewise. Only difference there is I really feel like being screwed over with the prices for music cd's. 99% of the music I buy is not to be found in a top 40 or something and do not get airplay on the radio, so those artists deserve the money......fuck all the rest, most of that is crap anyway. So it's no downloading anymore, besides music, but that's really to check things out and if I like what I hear I'll buy the cd. The internet is really handy for this, as chances are slim coming across the music I like and I don't have time to listen to all kinds of things in a store.
People downloading all and everything should be caught, I agree on that. Because most of them are not ever willing to pay for anything and that's a bad attitude.

[Leslie Lee III]

This approach doesn't work for the MPAA or the RIAA, how will it work for the comic industry? All it results in are better, more secure, more legally ambiously ways to download. Bootleggers are smarter than you, way smarter. Accept it, being open-minded and positive about it.

Now I'd never download anything illegally ever whatsoever, but a friend of a friend of mine was actually completely out of comics until he ran across some to download. Now he's regularly buying things that he would have never even looked at even if he had stuck with comics. Don't think that downloading is going to cause the end of the world and kill comics. It's manga, the internet and video games that are doing that.

[The Creeper]

I agree. I never have and never will download a comic. It's simply not the same as holding a comic book in my hand.


The comic industry doesn't make nearly as much $$$$$ as record company, movies, etc. I could could easily download a Metallica song (if I liked them, all of there new stuff sucks and I think they are all pricks IMO) because these guys already have more then enough money. The comic industry doesn't make nearly as much.

[headcase]

I'm going to suggest that you mind your own business. As someone that does download many comics, this directly effects me. If you had done ssuch great homework, you would see that serj and most everyone else at Zcult strongly encourage everyone to keep buying. In fact, most tell you that if you download somethign and you like it, to go out and buy it. They and most of the users realize that supporting the industry that brings us such joy is the only way to ensure it will still be there. I downlaod alot off the site. Mostly loder comics that are pretty far out of my price range. But I do get the newer books as weel. Not that many, and mostly stuff that I bought that week. Its a good way to be able to go back and reread a book without running the risk of damaging it. Also by putting them on a disk you can give them to friends, thereby exposong more people to something they might enjoy. You should realize that this isn't bad thing. Joe Q has encouraged it at one point. THis can bring comics to a lot of people and can help garner more interest in a product. Myself, after downloading Fables and a few others. I decided to buy them monthly. So, next time you get off on a rant, you should make sure that you know what you are talking about.

P.S.

You should definitely not be contacting anyone for any reason. Some of us aren't as forgiving. Fair warning!!

[TheFoo]

Originally posted by headcase
I'm going to suggest that you mind your own business. As someone that does download many comics, this directly effects me. If you had done ssuch great homework, you would see that serj and most everyone else at Zcult strongly encourage everyone to keep buying. In fact, most tell you that if you download somethign and you like it, to go out and buy it. They and most of the users realize that supporting the industry that brings us such joy is the only way to ensure it will still be there. I downlaod alot off the site. Mostly loder comics that are pretty far out of my price range. But I do get the newer books as weel. Not that many, and mostly stuff that I bought that week. Its a good way to be able to go back and reread a book without running the risk of damaging it. Also by putting them on a disk you can give them to friends, thereby exposong more people to something they might enjoy. You should realize that this isn't bad thing. Joe Q has encouraged it at one point. THis can bring comics to a lot of people and can help garner more interest in a product. Myself, after downloading Fables and a few others. I decided to buy them monthly. So, next time you get off on a rant, you should make sure that you know what you are talking about.

P.S.

You should definitely not be contacting anyone for any reason. Some of us aren't as forgiving. Fair warning!!

[jza1218]

Originally posted by headcase
I'm going to suggest that you mind your own business. As someone that does download many comics, this directly effects me. If you had done ssuch great homework, you would see that serj and most everyone else at Zcult strongly encourage everyone to keep buying. In fact, most tell you that if you download somethign and you like it, to go out and buy it. They and most of the users realize that supporting the industry that brings us such joy is the only way to ensure it will still be there. I downlaod alot off the site. Mostly loder comics that are pretty far out of my price range. But I do get the newer books as weel. Not that many, and mostly stuff that I bought that week. Its a good way to be able to go back and reread a book without running the risk of damaging it. Also by putting them on a disk you can give them to friends, thereby exposong more people to something they might enjoy. You should realize that this isn't bad thing. Joe Q has encouraged it at one point. THis can bring comics to a lot of people and can help garner more interest in a product. Myself, after downloading Fables and a few others. I decided to buy them monthly. So, next time you get off on a rant, you should make sure that you know what you are talking about.

P.S.

You should definitely not be contacting anyone for any reason. Some of us aren't as forgiving. Fair warning!!

Damn georgians...

[headcase]

Wow. An eyeroll. How insightful. Its that level of with that makes you so respected on these boards.

[jza1218]

Originally posted by headcase
Wow. An eyeroll. How insightful. Its that level of with that makes you so respected on these boards.

Who says hes respected...? I think you're giving him to much credit...

[TheFoo]

Originally posted by headcase
Wow. An eyeroll. How insightful. Its that level of with that makes you so respected on these boards.

Uh-huh... and you know what others think of me? Ooooo, I'm gonna tell teacher!

Thanks Jza!! And you're one to talk!

[headcase]

See, written down. Sarcasms just doesn't come across like you really want it too.

[christian]

Originally posted by comic_dealer
It's very possible that Mr. Stephenson has an agenda for the industry and Z-Cult in specific, but in the end, his arguement has no merit as it contradicts how the market works,

I think Mr, Stephenson has his agenda for the industry and against Z-Cult perfectly plain. Your misinformed and ill-conceived attempt to discredit him makes your own agenda equally as plain.

But let's take a moment to take a look at where you've gone wrong...

90% of all comic dealers on the North American continent purchase their books from a middle man, namely "Diamond Comics". Diamond Comics is a distributor for the larger companies, an independent entity.

Not sure where you got your 90% from, but nevertheless, this is essentially correct, pretty much the last time you tread in the waters of accuracy.

When a dealer orders his books from Diamond, Diamond has already placed and paid for an order from the companies.

The dealer then pays the distributor for the books. Who has already paid the companies for the books.

This couldn't be farther from the truth. Diamond does conduct the monetary transaction between retailers and the publishers, but Diamond is not a wholesaler. They don't buy comics.

Diamond distributes comics. They are the means by which publishers like DC and Marvel communicate with the retail community and collect their orders. Publishers then base their print runs on those orders, which are sent to printers.

Diamond then works with the printers to collect, warehouse and distribute the books to those retailers. For all these services they pocket a share of the action.

Diamond does not "buy" books FROM publishers. They buy books FOR retailers. That is a significant difference.

Creators are already paid by the companies who have made their profit from sales to the distributors.

Yes, it's true creators are paid their rates for completed works and/or their royalty rates are set by orders Diamond receives and not retail-level sales (meaning to consumers), but you don't get partial credit due to how misleading this argument is.

A large percentage of the products the industry publishes are serial in nature, they are part of a continuing series, either indefinite or of a fixed length.

If sales at the retail level for any issue in a continuing series suffer (for any number of reasons, piracy being one POSSIBLE reason), then the retailer has every reason to adjust their orders for subsequent issues negatively in response. Then the publisher does lose sales, and a creator can suffer due to lower royalty rates or the cancellation of a project due to insufficient sales.

In other words, 5 people downloading Pirate-Man #1 instead of buyng it means 5 less potential sales for a retailer, which may well mean five less ORDERS for Pirate-Man #2.

Explain to me how this doesn't potentially affect the publisher and creator again?

You also fail to mention or are ignorant of the distribution of graphic novels and comic books in the mass market, which in many cases are ordered from the publishers on a returnable basis.

In these cases a lost sale is a lost sale to the publisher, directly.

By the time you purchase a book from a dealer, it has, essentially been paid for TWICE!

That sounds nice and I'm sure appeals to those trying to justify piracy, but it has no relation to reality.

The only person who really loses out from piracy is the local dealer, and having talked to quite a few dealers personally, sales have not been hit or taken a dive due to piracy. If anything, because people have been able to read a book before buying, it has helped to make sales that may have not been made before.

I'm not sure saying the "only person losing out" is a very good justification, but that said, one CAN make the argument that follows.

Some smart people disagree on how internet piracy of media affects retail sales, and interesting discussion can take place, but YOU aren't contributing anything insightful or intelligant to the discourse.

Obviously, Mr. Stephenson doesn't have a firm grasp on how retailing in the comics industry or any other industry works!

One should be very careful about dismissing others when one's understanding of key issues is so tenuous.

I'm just saying....

[Terram]

Originally posted by christian
Some smart people disagree on how internet piracy of media affects retail sales, and interesting discussion can take place, but YOU aren't contributing anything insightful or intelligant to the discourse.

[gcapr678]

Originally posted by daveys
This is an open letter / appeal to comic fans.


blah blah blah bullshits blah blah blah bullshits again blah blah

I'd like to tell you where you can put your keyboard, but my English is not as good as it should be to find a periphrasis

why don't you consider mind your own business? i buy 90% of comics published in my country, you seem to have a lot of time and money to waste, why instead of doing this kind of idiocies you waste your money sending me a part of material will not ever be published in this country (dark horse, dc, we see nothing of this)?

[YDLM]

Originally posted by The Creeper
I agree. I never have and never will download a comic. It's simply not the same as holding a comic book in my hand.


The comic industry doesn't make nearly as much $$$$$ as record company, movies, etc. I could could easily download a Metallica song (if I liked them, all of there new stuff sucks and I think they are all pricks IMO) because these guys already have more then enough money. The comic industry doesn't make nearly as much.

Nuff Said.

[KSChris]

I'm not gonna lie and say I've never downloaded a comic before.. and I'll even say right out that since my financial situation has gotten worse with school and everything else taking up my money, I have downloaded alot more than I did in the past to keep up with the books that I love.. but I look at it like this.

I can download a book - if I like it, I'll buy it. If I don't? I won't. Its no different than reading a book in a shop. For the past two years, with no expenses at all pretty much.. I put forth at the very least $125 per WEEK on comics.. sometimes in the summers around $200 per WEEK. So don't get me wrong. I LOVE the comics industry.. but sometimes there are circumstances like mine where it cannot be helped.

Anyway.. from downloading comics, I have gotten into around 15 new books that I would never have considered before. I went out, and bought these books that I liked.. and so, to me, that equals nothing but good for the industry.

Yes.. when people take downloading to an extreme, it's a bad thing. And yeah.. when people have 280 gigs of nothing but comics, they should be in trouble for it.

I myself have never gone over 5 gigs of comics, which is honestly not that much.

Thats my three cents.

[scarlettspiderg]

The current generation, which is growing up with the Internet, has come to feel that downloading music, movies, books and now comics is acceptable.

First off, please don't generalise a whole generation. I'm part of todays generation, I grew up on the net and I dont feel its right to download music, books, movies or comics - unless you have already purchased them.

I'm also one of the users of Zcultfm. I download comics that are already in my collection (which consists of over 2000). I make a weekly visit to my local comic store, I still purchase TPBs from amazon. So why do I download? So that I can store a large percentage of comics in one place while travelling.

Zcultfm allows to me to download the comics so that I dont have to take them back out of my collection and sit infront of my scanner, and the site encourages users to purchase comics - it also allows readers to find comics that have long been out of print and that will hardley ever see print again - so where are the comic companies losing out on that??

On another foot, why dont Marvel and DC offer older comics for download (like Apples Itune store for music)?

I know this is my first time posting on Newsrama (I normally post on other forums) and sorry if I affended anyone with this post but I feel that I need to stick up for Zcultfm as it offers a service that I use.