TILTING @ WINDMILLS #20: COME TOGETHER

[MattBrady]

by Brian Hibbs

(#136 – August 2005)

I am of the mind that a tremendous number of the problems in the Direct Market are, in fact, solvable. I also believe that a large number of the problems that we face stem directly from the fact that since DM Retailers have no collective voice we cannot effectively negotiate with our partners in distribution and publishing.

So, maybe something should be done about that, huh?

You may have possibly heard something about the formation of ComicsPRO, a Direct Market retailer trade organization. Or, maybe not, we’ve been generally quiet up until now as we waited for the non-profit status to come through and a few more i’s to be dotted, and t’s to be crossed.

Well, the time has come, and many of the details are ready.

Click here for the full column.

[adamcasey]

Fantastic.

I wish ComicsPRO all the luck.

[John Gavin]

I just enrolled for a full membership. With Brian Hibbs & Joe Fields involved I know that this will not be a fly by night operation. I encourage all retailers to join. Remember there is strength in numbers.

[Michael C Lorah]

excellent. i wish all the best to ComicsPro!

[Rawle Austin]

Great stuff.

Strong foundations and unity in the direct market will lead to a healthy, sustainable industry in the long term.

Total respect to Brian Hibbs for being a pioneer in the field.


Growler

[Mr Wesley]

There have been several attempts to form industry associations over the years. I’m sure that more than a few of you remember the most recently announced attempt – an attempt that made scads of promises, detailing scores of programs they were interested in creating, and then basically disappeared without another word. We’re going to try to be different.

Is this the CIAA he's talking about? He may have a point--what did ever happen with that group?

[Cliffy]

Originally posted by MattBrady
Our next immediate goal is to add affordable health insurance

Oh, that's a good idea.

--Cliffy

[Foenix]

Oh, very nice. Hope it works out for you guys better than others before you. A unified voice for the retailers can hopefully only be a good thing.

I've always wanted to open a comic store, but there are great risks, certainly in these times, and while this doesn't immediately get rid of those, it is great to see something like this starting up. And no, I'm not running down to the real estate offices to grab up a building. I suck at business type stuff, so this is gonna remain a dream.

Despite there being NO comic stores for about a 90 minute drive in all directions. I take that as a sign.

J

[wilee4]

this sounds like it'll be great for the industry, best of luck!

[Midas]

This makes absolute sense and I certainly support the types of things they're doing out of the box. Those are things that save the retailers money without costing us customers anything.

I do have some concern that any real concessions won by a retailer trade group will come out of our hides rather than the hides of the publishers or the distributor(s)... Regardless, that's our problem and not the retailers, who I fully support trying to get the best deal for themselves. After all, I obviously have a vested interest in the success of my retailers (without them--no comics!).

[Cliffy]

Originally posted by Midas
I do have some concern that any real concessions won by a retailer trade group will come out of our hides rather than the hides of the publishers or the distributor(s)

Well, if that happens you can always call the Dpeartment of Justice and have the retailers thrown in jail for violations of the antitrust laws.

--Cliffy

[adamcasey]

Originally posted by Cliffy
Well, if that happens you can always call the Dpeartment of Justice and have the retailers thrown in jail for violations of the antitrust laws.

--Cliffy

Would we get a response from the DOJ? Don't they have some civil liberties to curtail?

[AlexLothos]

Originally posted by Mr Wesley
Is this the CIAA he's talking about? He may have a point--what did ever happen with that group?

That's who I was thinking, too. But as a small press publisher I know how it is not having something bombarding the news sites every month but working hard behind the scenes to really hit full force when the time is right. I'm giving them the benefit of a doubt and I really want to see them make a come back.

As for ComicsPRO itself I think this is a GREAT idea and I will be passing the links to any retailer who will listen to me. Is the invite open to UK retailers as well?

Oh, and when you're ready to open up doors to the small press guys, please give me a yell! I want in!

[Visioncomix]

This sounds like a great idea, especially with Lone Star Comics involved, which has to have great leverage with the publishers due to their size. Has Mile High been approached? With Lone Star & Mile High's leverage alone with the publishers, this would be a very formidable start. As an online retailer, curious why the membership is limited to storefront retailers only? There are some big online retailers (DCBS and TOW come to mind) that could add some significant leverage to this type of group, so why exclude them (and by inclusion our online business?).

[adamcasey]

Originally posted by Visioncomix
There are some big online retailers (DCBS and TOW come to mind) that could add some significant leverage to this type of group, so why exclude them (and by inclusion our online business?).

I don't really know anything about it, but I imagine that exclusive (or primarily) online stores don't face the same risks as a regular physical store. That is, an online store receives all of its orders for comics two months prior to their release. Then the store can select how much extra to order for back issues should the store carry those. The physical store is constantly having to guess how many to order.

[Nat Gertler]

Originally posted by Visioncomix
curious why the membership is limited to storefront retailers only? There are some big online retailers (DCBS and TOW come to mind) that could add some significant leverage to this type of group, so why exclude them (and by inclusion our online business?).

DCBS apparently actually has a storefront.

As for why exclude online-only businesses (and I'm not saying it's the right way to do things, just that there can be reasons), not only does it effectively set a certain minimum involvement in the field (keeping out those who have Diamond accounts largely for their personal use but sell a few comics through eBay to qualify as retailers) but there is also some reality that the interests of the brick-and-mortar retailer are often in conflict with those of the online retailer, as they create a different sort of competition.

[CMARTIN]

This is great news. I worked for an association for five years and had a very positive experience. Non-profit orgs can serve the needs of their members very well. Now, can I join? I only have an ebay store, but I have dreams of doing more...


check out my ebay auctions

[C.A. Luke]

Is this just for Comic Shops in the U.S.A or can Comic Shops in Australia and elsewhere join too?
The Comic Books Cafe(on-line comic shop in Australia) wants to know!

[genmgr]

Thanks, everyone, for your support. All of us on the comicsPRO Board believe in what we're doing, and we look forward to working with all of you.

Whether you are a fan, a fellow retailer, a publisher, or a distributor, we'll be working WITH you to make our industry as secure and stable as it's ever been. Some of you have questions about your eligibility for membership, and I want to address as many of those as I can.

Right now, membership is limited to people who have a brick-and-mortar storefront that sells comics, or people who are IN THE PROCESS of opening such a store. In the early stages, the Board feels that we need to be focused on specific goals. If we spread ourselves too thin initially, those goals can become muddy and our message lost in the maelstrom. By focusing on a core group to begin with, we can address their concerns and issues more fully.

Stores outside the United States are certainly eligible for membership, allowing you to participate in the forum and other educational programs that will come along in the future and, most importantly, having a voice within an organization that was designed to benefit you, too. Unfortunately, many of the benefits of the organization will be US-centric for the foreseeable future. The main factor in this is one of size.

When negotiating better prices for our members, as we did with the credit card processing agreement, we have to give the service providers a rough estimate of the market that they're hoping to capture. Unfortunately, we will not (in the near future) have such a "base" that we can negotiate very strongly on international members' behalf. Would I love for that to be otherwise? You betcha! And later, I hope that we'll have enough members outside the US to make this feasible.

We're actively contacting other retailers, with more signing on each week. I find the faith that these retailers show in the Board and in EACH OTHER to be very gratifying. To any of you who are interested, feel free to print out this tri-fold brochure (http://www.mycomicshop.com/cp/comicsprobrochure.pdf) and take it with you on your next trip to your local retailer and let them know that we're out here to help and work with them. There are committees looking for volunteers, and a course to be charted!

Thanks Again,
-CP

[Rory D. Root]

Comic Relief joined as soon as membership was opened up.

Retailers will benefit in terms of collective bargaining and ease in communicating concerns to Creators, Publishers, and Distributors.

As actions on these and other concerns are met, the readership should benefit not just from a healthier retailer base, but from improvements in the comics, books, and products as well.

Rory D. Root
COMIC RELIEF: THE Comic Bookstore
2026 Shattuck Ave.
Berkeley, Ca. 94704-1117
V 510/843-5002
F 510/540-1730
info@comicrelief.net
rory@comicrelief.net
www.comicrelief.net

[Frank_Augur]

This sounds like a retailer's union. It's the same sales slogan of "protect your rights". This isn't the 1950's anymore. Unions are more concerned with milking off of it's members and manipulating the attitudes of it's members rather than representing them. Organizations like this are often used to manipulate and control people. It allows publishers and distributors to pinpoint the retailers with the biggest voice of dissent. They can then focus on those retailers and address their non-conformist attitudes directly by using peer pressure.

Medical Insurance sounds great, but somebody is still paying for it. The retailer is paying for it. Yes, the insurance companies WILL offer a group discount. This is the bait for the hook they are trying to stick in your mouth. You can bet there is probably some larger group you can join to get even better insurance discounts than this organization offers.

If I was a retailer in this tight economy, I'd save my money.

FA

[Frank_Augur]

After reading the payment ech website pitch, it appears they specialize in data mining. They obviously co-op with software vendors to try and sell you software. They ~probably~ get a kickback on any sales of overpriced software.

They specialize in reporting. I'd expect that the purpose of this group is to indicate industry trends and areas of opportunity for the publishers to make more money--as in coax more sales and get more money out of your pocket whether you sell the product or not. I seriously doubt the publishers will ever care about your concerns, only making more sales from this arrangement. For larger companies in the industry, it also gives them informational leverage and a statistical angle by which to manipulate the little guy's competitive edge out of the picture.

Yes, I'm cynical... but whenever I see big retailers asking for money, I'm not inclined to believe it is for the little guy's good.

FA

[GaryDills]

Originally posted by Frank_Augur
This sounds like a retailer's union. It's the same sales slogan of "protect your rights". This isn't the 1950's anymore. Unions are more concerned with milking off of it's members and manipulating the attitudes of it's members rather than representing them.

If I was a retailer in this tight economy, I'd save my money.

FA

Sorry you feel this way. This group ISN'T out to bilk retailers for some nefarious purpose. We're here to create a larger net of cooperation among a varied group of mavericks and through this cooperation solve or lessen the effect of some of the things that affect all of us.

The CC processing rate alone is going to save my company $4000 a year beyond what I, at my volume, could negotiate on my own. For my $300 membership fee, this alone would make joining the organization a cash positive one for me. So if saving money is a store owner's only concern, joining would be the FIRST thing that they should do.

One of the reasons that the founding board has focused on concrete things that will save the retailer money is that we'd like to make it a no-brianer to get every comic store owner on board so that every voice gets a say in the process. As to publishers and distributors being able to silence the dissenters more effectively. What do the think the case is now with 1000's of voices each voicing their opinions in the dark to said distributors and publishers, they can pick and choose who or what they want to hear. With a unified voice we should be able to better be heard and be much less likely to be dismissed.

Thanks for your time,

[Frank_Augur]

Originally posted by GaryDills
Sorry you feel this way. This group ISN'T out to bilk retailers for some nefarious purpose. We're here to create a larger net of cooperation among a varied group of mavericks and through this cooperation solve or lessen the effect of some of the things that affect all of us.

The CC processing rate alone is going to save my company $4000 a year beyond what I, at my volume, could negotiate on my own. For my $300 membership fee, this alone would make joining the organization a cash positive one for me. So if saving money is a store owner's only concern, joining would be the FIRST thing that they should do.

One of the reasons that the founding board has focused on concrete things that will save the retailer money is that we'd like to make it a no-brianer to get every comic store owner on board so that every voice gets a say in the process. As to publishers and distributors being able to silence the dissenters more effectively. What do the think the case is now with 1000's of voices each voicing their opinions in the dark to said distributors and publishers, they can pick and choose who or what they want to hear. With a unified voice we should be able to better be heard and be much less likely to be dismissed.

Thanks for your time,

Simple solution. Since all of this is for the retailers good... make it 100% free to join. This organization is a buisness decision for someone. If it was all setup to generate free money and savings for a retailer, why charge membership dues at all? It would increase membership must faster if it did not involve spending money.

Somebody has a goal to make money off of this deal. Full disclosure would be to open everyones books in the process and show where and how. pay-men-tech isn't handing out free savings and partnering out of their heart's goodwill. They have a buisness plan to make money off of the arrangement. Selling software appears to be one such arena. You can already factor that the credit card savings are intended to be spent on software. Where else is payment-ech looking to reclaim that credit card money? Maybe selling statistical data to the larger retailers and publishers? If so, that is done for the purpose of manipulating the consumer and his options when he goes to buy product. I am affected by that as a consumer. Is this a way to find out credit card numbers of those who have disposable income vs. those who can't afford what they are buying? Information IS money. I don't think the savings a retailer gets is necessarily worth it if the retailer is giving away data which can be used to leverage their influence out of the market. Organizations like this are setup to control dissent just as much as they are to make money. It is a meat grinder to make steak look like hamburger so someone can sell hamburger as steak.

Even if I'm wrong, retailers that join an organization like this need to be aware of the risks.

FA

[Nat Gertler]

Originally posted by Frank_Augur
This sounds like a retailer's union.

Nope. They are not dealing with employers, and the retailers aren't bound to follow anything ComicPro comics up with.

It allows publishers and distributors to pinpoint the retailers with the biggest voice of dissent.

The dissenting voices in this field are hardly a secret to the publishers and distributors.

Medical Insurance sounds great, but somebody is still paying for it. The retailer is paying for it. Yes, the insurance companies WILL offer a group discount. This is the bait for the hook they are trying to stick in your mouth.

Oh, no! They're not baiting the "get the advantages of working as a group" hook with an advantage of working as a group?! How dare they!

You can bet there is probably some larger group you can join to get even better insurance discounts than this organization offers.

So you shouldn't join this group because there is some other group you can join?
[quote]If I was a retailer in this tight economy, I'd save my money.[/QUOT]And throwing away thousands extra in insurance costs and credit card processing fees is saving your money how, exactly?

I'd expect that the purpose of this group is to indicate industry trends and areas of opportunity for the publishers to make more money--as in coax more sales and get more money out of your pocket whether you sell the product or not.

You do realize that this group is not being founded by publishers, but by retailers, right?

Since all of this is for the retailers good... make it 100% free to join.

And who funds the very real expenses involved in administering a group like this? What little money faerie comes down to do that?

Oh, right, your goal isn't actually to have a group like this work. Your goal is to stop it. And under your "somebody has a goal to make money off of this deal" style of logic, we can assume that you're doing so to line your own pockets. Who can we assume is funding you? Publishers? Distributors? Gnomes of Zurich?