FROM NINTEY CANDLES TO BROWNSVILLE: CATCHING UP WITH NEIL KLEID

[MattBrady]

by Chris Arrant

It was a time of change. Still reeling from the aftermath of World War I, and already experiencing the tremors of World War II, the United States in the 1920s & 1930s was in a tumultuous time. As in previous decades, America was seen as a shining beacon of hope and prosperity, drawing immigrants from Europe, Asia and beyond into its open arms with promises of a better life. While some calmly engaged and embrace the American way of life, others grabbed it by the throat and made it bend to their wishes.

In the upcoming OGN Brownsville (NBM Publishing), writer Neil Kleid and artist Jake Allen shadow two such criminals, Albert "Tick Tock" Tanennbaum and Abe "Kid Twist" Reles through the rise and fall of their criminal careers. Some called them gangsters, some called them thugs; but in these pages, Kleid & Allen get to the root of each man's world and finds his true motivations. Newsarama had a chance to speak with Neil Kleid about this exciting 2005 release, as well as look back at another book of his, Ninety Candles.

Newsarama: What was it about the story of Murder Inc. that made it viable to you as a comic?

Neil Kleid: Well who doesn't enjoy a good mob story, right?

I've always been fascinated by the criminal world before the 1950s and I've always wanted to tell a gangster story. I suppose, like Allie, I've been drawn to the patter, the life and was looking for a way to get involved. Thing is, I wasn't interested in creating a "fake mob" like you see in so many gangster stories in comics... I wanted my world to be set in the actual history of the Mafia. I wanted my characters to sit in the same room as Lucky Luciano and all the rest. That's one of the things I dug about Road to Perdition. It's one of the things that bothered me about Judd Winick's Caper.

And then I watched Lepke, the movie they made about the life of Louis "Lepke" Buchalter with Tony Curtis. While a great deal of it is pretty hokey, I was captivated by the idea of this big time mobster controlling his criminal underworld from a series of bunkers all over New York. It was sort of like a comic book villain, plotting the world's destruction while hiding from the superheroes. At the end of the movie we meet Abe Reles - a throwaway character who ends up ratting on everyone. And I was like, "Hey... there's a bigger story there someone's not telling us!" So I did a bit of research and discovered that there were all of these little hoodlums out there that all contributed to the larger story of the Mafia - and more importantly to me as an Orthodox Jew, the Jewish Mob. I'm from Detroit where you keep hearing about The Purple Gang and had never really read up about the Jewish Mafia. I knew all the Italian players, and a good deal of the Irish. But apart from Lanksy and Bugsy? Zip.

So I dug a little and found out about Reles and Pittsburgh Phil and Gangy Cohen and Mendy Weiss and so on. Did you see Band of Brothers? It's the story of the individual soldiers of Easy Company from D-Day until V-E Day and it lets us see that these heroes, these men who gave their lives for us, had personalities and individual hopes and dreams. I suppose my story could be subtitled "Band of Bad Guys", because that's essentially what it does - shines a light on the personalities, hopes and fears of these nameless hoods you see standing in the shadows of movies like The Godfather and Once Upon A Time In America.

I never pictured this book as a "comic book." It's always been a graphic novel to me. It's too big to be a "comic book" per se. There's far too much to say and I'm not even sure I said everything I wanted to.

NRAMA:How were Jewish gangsters different than the stereotypical Italian gangster?

NK: I think it had a lot to do with background and where the individuals came from. See, old-school gangsters - referred to as “Mustaches or Mustache Petes”, carried over the idea of “mafia” to America from Sicily. However, the American gangster didn't necessarily kowtow to the Mustaches, in fact the younger gangs and hoods felt stifled by the "old ways" of doing things... the tributes, the old heirarchies, etc. The young Italians like Luciano and Costello took their cues from the gangs formed and molded in the late 1800s - the type of loose gangs you read about in Herbert Asbury's Gangs of New York and see in Sergio Leone's Once Upon A Time In America. Neighborhood kids rolling drunks, selling booze and the like. Eventually they graduated into the larger gangs and into rackets, numbers, and extortion. And it wasn't just the Italians - you see the same thing with the Irish, Russians, Orientals and the Jews. A diversified gangland that's been carried from the streets of the Five Points or waterfront of San Francisco to today.

But the reason, I feel, that Jews and Italians bonded over the idea of "mafia" and the reason guys like Luciano and Meyer Lansky went into business with one another was this sense of history and revolution. You've got young Sicilians using the formation of the Combination - a common name for the Five Families - as a way of leaving the old hierarchies of the Mustache Petes in the past, and you've got young Yids like Lansky and Lepke using it to get away from their religion, the ghettos and the Eastern European traditions forced on them by their parents. Sure, everyone wanted to get well money wise, and sure the freedom to do whatever they wanted was great but at its root, I think that’s what the Mafia is all about: revolution.

So what makes the Jewish revolution different than the Italian one? Well, that depends on the man and what he's looking for. You've got Jews like Lansky and Arnold Rothstein who are after the money - and, in Rothstein's case the thrill I suppose, and then you've got a Jew like Benny Siegel who (in Lansky's estimation) didn't respect money and was after flash and respect. You've got Italians like Luciano and Costello who were amazing with business as opposed to some of the Petes who wouldn't have two cents to rub together without the tributes offered them in the Sicilian neighborhoods.

Were they different? Not as much as we'd like. I mean, human is human and everyone wants to get out of squalor. Each group had its individual religion and each group had its individual history - but once they got to the streets of New York, a wise guy’s a wise guy’s a wise guy.

NRAMA: Tell us more about your main characters, Albert Tannennbaum and Abe Reles. What makes them tick?

NK:Here's the perfect example when I talk about individual differences. If you read books like Burton Turkus' Murder Inc. and Rich Cohen's Tough Jews, you can see subtle differences in the range and pastiche of mobsters that cross your path. All these guys - and there are a lot - may have ended up in the same place... on the corner, clipping cars, running protection rackets... but they didn't all come from low income housing projects or Delancey street two-house homes.

You've got a guy like Abe Reles, right? When you think of the words "stone cold gangster" you think of Reles. Here's this pug of a guy from Brooklyn who fought his way up from the corners, killing or edging out anyone who got in his way. Someone once said that Reles had a face that just ached to be punched - he had his friends and even more enemies. But he knew what he was doing, so guys respected him. But Reles was built for killing. He was a goon, and the Combination used him for that. He didn't work in Louis Lepke's office and he wasn't always in on everything that was happening in "the office." He was hired help, a gun they pointed, and I think in the end that was one of the things that set him against them.

Then there's Allie, who's the centerpiece of our drama. Allie came from a little money - nothing too extravagant, but enough that his Dad owned a nice resort in the Catskills. Allie didn't get into the gangs and the life because he had nothing and no one... he got into it for the same reason I can watch The Godfather or Goodfellas three times in a week: he was fascinated by the life. Sure, his family was still fighting to get out of the same ghetto everyone else was, but they were a bit better off. Allie had an entire legit life and career he could've led and didn't need to get into the gangs like Reles did to survive. But he did. He was taken in by the shine and glamour of the three piece suits and fancy cars and found himself seduced by the money, the women, the power. And Allie was smart, too - the kind of guy that probably could have gone to college rather than "college." Allie worked in Lepke's business office. Allie was the guy they sent to set up a fake business in Newark as a cover for hiding a fugitive Lepke. Allie was smart, and smart guys were invaluable to the Combination, what with two thirds of the muscle being just that - muscle.

So when crafting this tale, I chose to almost compare and contrast these two differing gangsters... one a street thug fighting to make a name, the other a whiz kid who fell into an easy thing. Cohen, in Tough Jews, notes that Allie was the wheelman on a hit against Reles back before Reles' troop got folded into the Families. That, I think, is their earliest known confrontation and in my eye, the one that really laid the groundwork for their future working relationship. Hollywood tends to focus on the big boys - Benny "Bugsy" Siegel, Lansky, Luciano, Dutch Schultz, but I wanted to give the mafia their "Band of Brothers" story, in a sense, pointing the camera on at least two or three of the lesser-known personalities.

NRAMA: How did Allie & Reles get their unique nicknames?

NK:"Allie" or "Allie Boy" was a common nickname for kids named Albert or Alfonse back in the day. Our Allie was given his Mafia nickname "Tick Tock" mainly because he wouldn't shut the hell up... like a ticking clock.

Reles went by the name "Kid Twist" after Max Zweibach, Monk Eastman's lieutenant from the days of the Five Points. Rumor has it he was also given the name because it was his favorite kind of candy and that he enjoyed strangling the life out of his victims.

NRAMA: It sounds like you thorough investigated the background of this book before you picked up your pen. Overall, how much research did you do for this book, and how long did it take you?

NK: I researched this book for a full year - beginning with simply watching half the movies I name-checked earlier, and then studying the world they portrayed. From there it was reading a lot of books - from Cohen and Turkus' books, which are invaluable, to Paul Sann's Kill The Dutchman and scores of biographies of Lepke, Lansky and even old Italian gangsters, just in hopes of cross-referencing stories that touched on Murder Incorporated.

I also spent a great deal of time on the internet; MurderInc.com, most notably and Mr. Murder along with random Google trawls of various names, facts and figures.

I also asked a lot of questions - my parents helped give me some background on what Brooklyn was like at the end of the 1950s, well past the troops' prime, but it did help set my mind's eye as to what the area looked like, some of the buildings and the like. Jake Allen [the artist] and I send each other photos and wanted posters we find online or in books... I know Jake's a fiend for old 1930s architectural drawings and photos.

And of course, I went out and killed a few people. Don't tell the Feds.

NRAMA: Living the book, huh? Anyway..

How did you hook up with Jake Allen for this book?

NK:I had been looking for an artist via the traditional methods - Digital Webbing, message board posting, and so on but realized that if I was having a hard time getting an artist to commit to a 22 page comic book, there was going to be no way in hell that I was going to find someone willing to work on a 196 page book - for back end pay.

I had gotten to the point where I was going to break the book into 22 page chapters and put it out that way, when my pal and Instant Message Punching Bag Andrew (Ghostbusters, MU) Dabb mentioned this guy he had worked on one of his short Slices stories for opi8.com. Dabb sent me the link to Jake's story and I had to admit that he had nailed that old-timey historical vibe I wanted for Brownsville. I emailed Jake and we got to talking, and he was more excited about it than I - apparently people kept asking him to work on superhero stuff, and he wanted a "real world" project to work on.

We clicked pretty much from the get-go and I have to say that my working relationship with Jake is probably the purest and most collaborative creative partnerships I've ever had. I can't wait until we're sitting together at a con, signing copies of this book because I think we're both going to feel such a sense of accomplishment and pride once it's finally done.

NRAMA: Describe for us how you connected with NBM Publishing to publish this book.

NK: Ironically enough, it all happened via another publisher.

Jake and I had been working on Brownsville for roughly two months - the art stage, anyway, and had about twenty pages under our belt when I decided to attend SPX for the first time. I was going with the mind to sell this book to someone - or at least generate some buzz. I had at least five publishers in mind for Brownsville and was considering two or three more but didn't want to just give them a two page pitch and some letter size photocopies that would end up in the garbage, right?

Enter Larry Young.

Larry had just sent me a copy of True Facts, a book that's basically the strong right hand of self-publishers the world over. One of the things that struck me, a guy who likes to shmooze at conventions but hates to pitch there, was the story about a creative team that walked into a convention with pre-sealed, pre-designated envelopes with the words "TOP SECRET" on them, distributed them and got their book picked up.

Well... I can do that.

I attended SPX 2003 with seven pre-sealed, pre-designated manila envelopes containing a pocket folder with two pitches, my business card, samples of past work and what I refer to as "the BROWNSVILLE sampler." The sampler contained information about the book, the pitch, the sample pages and contact information. The only things on the front of the envelope were the name of the publisher and a small label that read "LIMITED DISTRIBUTION." On Friday, I walked up to each of the seven targeted publishers, handed them the packet, explained who I was and told them which table they could find me at. I thanked them for listening and walked away.

Later that day, my friend Kevin informed me that he had seen Terry Nantier, NBM's publisher, leafing through the Brownsville sampler. One week after the convention I followed up with him and he informed me that he liked what he saw and wanted to talk terms.

One month later Jake and I had signed contracts.

NBM has been nothing but great to work with - Terry has made himself available as a publisher, editor and advisor and both Jake and I really look forward to his input. We really feel like we belong to a "family" and can't wait to finish this first book for them and begin working on the next.

NRAMA: Changing subjects on you here; your "claim to fame" as it were, right now is your OGN Ninety Candles, which won a Xeric Grant in 2003. For those that haven't yet picked that up, how would you describe the book?

NK: A touching family history that documents the trials, tribulations, heartbreak and successes involved in being a cartoonist. It's not a pretty picture - lots of people find it depressing, even. It's honest and open-minded and I think anyone who's ever been in comics or wants to be can relate: from the new creator all the way to the golden-ager. It shows that there are no limits as far as what you can do with the medium of comics. A personal journey that leads into a legacy passed from father to son. Wonderful book design - 48 pages printed on a cougar off-white text in a Hunter Green ink by the good people at WestCan Printing; custom size and a touch of graphic design flair I never knew I had in me. It's a really nice package - go ahead. Try not to pick it up. I dare you.

NRAMA: With the unique plan of doing one panel a day for ninety days, did you plan out what was going to be in each panel beforehand?

NK: Nope. The plan was to start at Panel One and simply base the next panel of the previous day. It got scripted and created as I went along – for better or for worse. The problem was that, being a writer, I was having an issue creating a story without knowing the beginning and ending beforehand. I mean, the journey of life really sets up your “bookends” as life and death, right? But I didn’t want the book to just end with a shot of the protagonist lying in his deathbed… so I cheated a bit… I mapped the last few pages out beforehand while sticking to the prearranged format. This way the reader gets a nice little surprise and a much better conclusion thought it does veer from the “no script” experiment.

Okay, now everyone can go to the Talk@Newsarama boards and tell me I’m a cop out or something.

NRAMA: Nah, they wouldn't do that... would they? This book has been out for a number of months; what has been the general response so far from readers?

NK: I’m at Wizard World Chicago, right? And I sell a copy to a girl at a nearby table. Sunday night, I’m sitting in the bar with assorted comics hooligans and see the girl and her man, both who I thought were pretty nice. The guy’s like, "dude, you made my girlfriend cry at the table." She comes running over, gives me a hug and tells me she read it twice and it made her break into tears. I got an email from a friend who said it broke him down in the middle of a YMCA.

Everyone who’s gotten a copy has thrown emails at me that include "the most important book I’ve read this year," "it’s my life right now" and "is it autobiographical?” One reviewer said it was the most unique thing he’s read this year; another called it "touching." One guy said he hated my drawing style. You can’t please everyone. Some people aren’t sure what to make of it. Some people cry after reading it and ask for four copies to give to friends.

I’ll say this, most of the "see myself in the book" feedback comes from people just getting into the biz or those who have been in for a while now. I’d love to hear what a Will Eisner has to say; someone who’s been in the biz for a good, long while.

NRAMA: Being that the story is about a cartoonist, how much of this is autobiographical?

NK: Well, I’m just turning thirty, so it can’t be all autobiographical. I’d say most of the first thirty years are (except I’m not married yet). The rest is “projected autobio.”

NRAMA: What was your favorite part of doing Ninety Candles?

NK: There’s a few, really. Creatively, it allowed me to stretch my legs as far as style, method and format goes. I got to play with timing and spacing while putzing around with cross-hatch shading and charcoal pencils. It also gave me structure. I think the best thing any creator can do for him/herself is work out a consistent schedule. An hour a day. Two hours a day where you’re doing nothing but writing or drawing. The phone is shut off, the Xbox is put away. You’re Johnny or Janey Comic Book now. I’m having the toughest time at the moment, with three books in the works and two more on my plate. I’m feeling a tad burned out, so I’ll sit down, bang out five pages of script or a page of pencils sketches and say “ok… what’s on HBO right now?” That’s the WORST thing to do. You gotta keep to the schedule, even if it’s not usable – you can go back and rewrite or redraw… but this way you keep working.

Professionally, it put me in touch with a lot of information I never would have know before – from the Diamond Distribution submission process to the basics of quoting and printing a book all the way to marketing, promotion and fan/reader interaction. Emotionally, however, the best part has been seeing the reactions of folks who have lived the life. People involved in the industry in a professional capacity have read the book and emailed me to say “that was me!” I’ve gotten tearful thank-yous from readers at conventions and long, heartfelt emails form librarians, fans, professionals and retailers calling the book names like “jewel”, “masterpiece” and “touching memoir.”

NRAMA: OK... how about the other side of the coin: what was the worst part of creating Ninety Candles?

NK: God, the page-a-day pace. Everything got in the way and there were days where I just did not feel like drawing this book. I hated looking at the sketchbook and would go draw or write something else. Anything else. I gave up at page 60 and put it away, promising to get back to it like half a dozen projects I have on my to do list. But then I won the Xeric grant, so I picked it back up and actually found myself revitalized.

Free money will do that to you.

NRAMA: How did winning a grant from the Xeric Foundation affect Ninety Candles? What would it have been like had Xeric not helped out?

Unpublished, probably.

I had given up the book about two to three months before I won the grant. I had show it around to some people, most of who said “good idea, but it won’t work.” One publisher encouraged me to start again, rethink about writing a script and just start again. I didn’t have the money to publish it and no one wanted to take a chance so I basically just said “the hell with it” and chalked it up to experimentation.

And then I won. Like I said, it’s surprising what free money does.

The grant has also given the book a little name recognition. It’s one thing for me to say “Hi, have you read Ninety Candles, my self published book?” and quite another to say “Hi, have you read my graphic novella Ninety Candles, winner of a 2003 Xeric Grant?” I tell publishers I’m a Xeric winner and they tend to listen slightly better. It’s nice, but I still put my gold plated boxer on one toe at a time.

Brownsville, a 196 page OGN with artist Jake Allen, will debut from NBM Publishing in late 2005. Ninety Candles, a 48 page graphic novella, is available now for $5.95 from comic stores nationwide (JUL043096). For more information on Neil Kleid and his work, visit his website: www.RantComics.com.

[DavidGallaher]

I think Neil is a creator on the brink of huge success for 2005!

I loved 90 CANDLES and I am looking forward to reading BROWNSVILLE - both from a historical perspective and from a criminal perspective.

Now if only I could get an Irish Mob story into the direct market ;-)

[neil kleid]

Thanks, Dave!

There's a great book called "And All the Saints" which is a fictionalized account of the life of Owney "The Killer" Madden. Madden was one of the big time Irish hitmen who allied himself with the Five Families in the Twenties and Thirties.

I really dug the book - and it's timeline stretches from the "Gangs of New York" period all the way until the end of the 1940s.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&n=507846

[Fred C Dobbs]

Hi Neil,
with a shared interest in the subject matter ( go figure, another Jew from Detroit) I'm really looking forward to this.

When you have a few minutes to catch your breath and rest,
I suggest you look up the book "The Purple Gang" by Paul Kavieff,
which thoroughly covers "Organized Crime in Detroit 1910 - 1945)

rob

[neil kleid]

Nice! Thanks, Fred... I missed that one.

I'm actually in the middle of reading "The Big Bankroll" - a book about Arnold Rothstein, but I'm going to get that and another book, "Gangster City" by Patrick Downey from Amazon!

Credit card- ho!

[Ryan Twombly]

I hadn't heard of Neil or his work before this, but man, what an interview! I enjoyed this more than a lot of the books I read. I'll look up 90 Candles ASAP.

[KingMixer]

I've heard of Neil, but after reading the interview I've got to read this book, there's been no great gangster movies or comics in some time.

-Mark Smith
AJB

[neil kleid]

Thanks guys - whether you've heard of me or not, I think anyone who enjoys a good mafia story will dig what Jake and I are laying down.

Jake's going to knock everyone's socks off and I imagine I'll never get to work with him again after the offers start pouring in...!

Ryan: Have a gander at NINETY CANDLES over at:

www.rantcomics.com/rant-ninetycandles.html

If you're a comics creator or simply a devotee of the medium, this is a book that'll speak to you.

[Ryan Twombly]

I'm just a devotee right now Neil, but in the coming year I hope to change that. Sometime in the next 24 months I may even try to wrest you away from NBM....

I'll definitely try to find Ninety Candles and Brownsville.

[ThatGirl]

I just thought this was interesting and I found this because my Grandfather was Gangy Cohen

If you would like any information about him and what happened when he left......i'll be more then happy to help.

Good Luck on your next project.

[neil kleid]

Originally posted by ThatGirl
I just thought this was interesting and I found this because my Grandfather was Gangy Cohen

If you would like any information about him and what happened when he left......i'll be more then happy to help.

Good Luck on your next project.

wow.

just sent you an email. thanks!

neil

[ThatGirl]

Your very welcome..........I just replied to your email

I look forward to getting Brownsville.......as that is where my father was born

As I read the interview about your books etc.......... It was nice to see others interested in the old Jewish Mafia. It was never spoken about in our home except for years later....and being a girl and the grand daughter of a "gangster" I find it all a bit romantic. lol..... Told you I was a girl!

I just hope that people remember that those were the times and places that my grandfather happened to be. I never knew "Gangy Cohen"........... I just knew Grandpa. Lucky for me........he is in alot of old movies and I get to see him whenever I want .

Look forward to hearing from you again.

[neil kleid]

"I just hope that people remember that those were the times and places that my grandfather happened to be. I never knew "Gangy Cohen"........... I just knew Grandpa. "

That there is a quote worthy of a future book...