UPDATED: EVEN MORE DC COMICS NEWS! [Archive]

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MichaelDoran

11-10-2002, 08:28 PM

<img src="http://classic.newsarama.com/DC/dcanim.gif" width="80" height="78" align="right" alt="click for all the full stories" border="0"></a>If you a fan of DC Comics, today may feel like Halloween night. You’ve been to every house your little feet can drag you to, you’ve stuffed your face full of every treat you got your hands on, and you can’t eat another bite… But wait, mom bought too much candy?? Got room for more..? You know you do...

In addition to the details of DC’s prepared preview program released today, the publisher also revealed a few bits of info “off the script”, and our man on the scene, retailer and publisher of Comics Shop News Cliff Biggers, checked in with the update.

Wildstorm also has another League project in the works for release in conjunction with the film - an oversized hardcover two-volume deluxe collection of the first limited series, similar in format to Absolute Authority. Book One will feature the complete mini-series and Book Two will feature Moore’s complete scripts from the series.

Wildstorm also reports that Alan Moore is already starting to think about the next League of Extraordinary Gentlemen adventure. [CORRECTION] Scott Dunbier added the next mini-series by Moore and Kevin O’Neil will feature a League of the past, along with a League of a few decades later, circa World War 1.

NEW ITEM! Speaking about the return of Planetary, RRP attendee Warren Ellis had this to say to retailers about the series…

“Provided that your Planetary fans haven’t died of old age, here’s what you can tell them. Johnny [Cassaday’s] drawing right now; he’s working on Planetary #16 - the Chinese Kung Fu issue; #17 - jungle action; #18 - first men on the moon; #19 - rendezvous with Galactus; and then Planetary/Batman: Night on Earth.

“John’s back on the job and we’re looking at spring for Planetary #16, and then we’re looking at a bi-monthly schedule.”

Author/Green Arrow writer Brad Meltzer will return to DC after he finishes his next novel.

“One of the great phenomena that I’ve noticed in the last few years is that writers would start their careers in comics and leave, guys like Mickey Spillane and Mario Puzo, who’d go on to fame and fortune,” said Mike Carlin. “Now we have guys coming to us - Michael Chabon doesn’t have to do this to feed his family! He loves it. Brad Meltzer’s established and famous. What we’re able to do these days is have our door open; we want to make sure that anyone who wants to play with our toys has an open door.”

And on that note, Carlin said he’s going to be working with Monty Pythoner John Cleese on a Superman comic book.

“John and his partner, Kim Howard Johnson, have come up with a Superman Elseworlds called True Brit,” said Carlin. “It’s ‘What if Superman’s rocketship lands in England and the tabloids chase him away.’ I have an offer out to an artist; I don’t have him confirmed yet, but I think it’ll happen.”

“How do we get a guy like John Cleese to do a comic book?” Carlin asked himself. “We do it because comics are cool, and these guys love our characters. We’re not figuring that anyone will say no, necessarily; this is something we’re taking advantage of this year.”

Next fall, Pantheon Books will publish Mythology: The DC Comics Art of Alex Ross, art directed by Chip Kidd with an intro by M. Night Shyamalan. The volume will also feature an original eight-page Superman and Batman comic story by Kidd & Ross and a retelling of Robin’s origin by Paul Dini & Ross.

According to the publisher, Road to Perdition creator Max Allen Collins is preparing two graphic novel sequels to the original for DC, one to be drawn by Jose Luis Garcia-Lopez.

Editor Eddie Berganza says a Smallville ongoing series is in the works that will ship bi-monthly. “We’ll explore the ‘in-betweens’ of what happens between episodes,” said the editor. “We’ll see Clark and Pete go camping, when Pete has Clark demonstrate all of his powers.”

Berganza said Smallville along with the announced Birds of Prey adaptation will be used to try to “grab” new comic book readers, and that the comics may be published in a magazine format to better try to attract those readers.

The Teen Titans animated series is set to debut on the Cartoon Network in 2003, with episodes to be later on Kids WB. DC called the upcoming program “interesting”; as it will be their first “anime-influenced younger-skewing cartoon show.”

In addition, the Justice League series has been picked up for another season. And Superfriends will begin to be made available on VHS and DVD on 4/22/03.

The Vertigo series Midnight, Mass. is in development for live action TV treatment with Joel Silver and Warner Bros, along with Starman by Tollin/Robbins and ABC.

Finally, DC said a Superman film is in “active pre-production” right now.

The Challengers of the Unknown Volume 2 Archives debuting this spring will test a new, thinner Archive format with a new lower price of $39.95

Vertigo X Preview is a 99-cent comic that comes out in February. The 48-page book features a new Shade the Changing Man story by Peter Milligan and Mike Allred, plus interviews, “odd & nifty features”, and sneak peeks at upcoming projects including Sandman: Endless Nights.

Rick Veitch’s Can’t Get No Vertigo mini-series will be published in a new format. It’s three volumes of a half-sized horizontal format, 150 pages each in black and white, told on two tracks.

“It’s told visually, and there’s a narrative that relates to the story but it doesn’t exactly tell you what’s going on, so you’re really reading two stories at the same time,” explained Karen Berger. “It’s experimental but accessible - people get scared by the word experimental.

“Rick is one of the best writer/artist in comics in terms of stretching the medium and he’s doing some incredible stuff. People are surprised that he’s doing creator-owned stuff for us, but it’s wonderful to be doing this book with him. A lot of books in different formats seem to be attracting readers, and this will be one of them.”

Kingdom Come Action Figures are in the works, with figures of Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Superman, Shazam, Magog, Batman, and more in the plans…

<a href=http://classic.newsarama.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=000039>CLICK HERE</a> to return to the main menu to read about more of DC’s upcoming projects.

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Walt Grogan

11-10-2002, 09:34 PM

The Kingdom Come action figures sound cool. I hope DC can convince Alan Moore to allow production of the Watchmen figures!

Walt

Somebody

11-10-2002, 09:40 PM

[quote]Originally posted by michaelDORAN:
Berganza said Smallville along with the announced Birds of Prey adaptation will be used to try to “garb” new comic book readers, and that the comics may be published in a magazine format to better try to attract those readers.<hr></blockquote>

What, they expect them to wear the comics? ;)

Lex

11-10-2002, 09:42 PM

It's days like today that make me proud to be a DC fan.

Whoo-hoo!

Sean Walsh

11-10-2002, 09:47 PM

KingStalin

11-10-2002, 09:52 PM

Dude, Dude! Kingdom Come figures? Holy Chadarooni!!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

firestorm003

11-10-2002, 10:02 PM

and still no word about FIRESTORM, I wonder what the future holds for a great character

lemmer

11-10-2002, 10:23 PM

WHERE'S THE ENNIS/DILLON ONGOING?!?! :mad:

I'm sorry, all of this is totally awesome, but that's what I've really been checking this out for...

J -

11-10-2002, 11:08 PM

the hell with everything else!!! midnight, mass is being developed as a tv seres!!!!!!!!!!

grendel x

11-10-2002, 11:25 PM

Vertigo X Preview is a 99-cent comic that comes out in February. The 48-page book features a new Shade the Changing Man story by Peter Milligan and Mike Allred,

Omigod, Shade the Changing Man w/art by Mike Allred and it's 99 cents. I'm at a loss for words...

Pariah

11-10-2002, 11:33 PM

Umm, anyone seen my copy of League of Extraordinary Gentlemen Vol. 2 number 4?

Dan Feeser

11-10-2002, 11:45 PM

[quote]Originally posted by michaelDORAN:
The Teen Titans animated series is set to debut on the Cartoon Network in 2003, with episodes to be later on Kids WB. DC called the upcoming program “interesting”; as it will be their first “anime-influenced younger-skewing cartoon show.<hr></blockquote>

Have we learned nothing from Transformers: Armada? :rolleyes:

FortressMaximus

11-10-2002, 11:57 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Dan Feeser:


Have we learned nothing from Transformers: Armada? :rolleyes: <hr></blockquote>

******We have learned that people who have no writing credits should not be given free reign over a show. We've also learned that while bad animation is somewhat expected, bad writing (like calling your Minicon by the wrong name 3 TIMES!!)
is simply sloppy. The writing on other shows like He-Man is top notch most of the time and the writers can't even get a few characters matched with the correct name??

And as for the Titans show...why???

Give me Young Justice any day of the week! (well, either YJ or maybe a Power Pack animated series with me as the head writer :) ).

FortressMaximus

MichaelDoran

11-11-2002, 12:03 AM

[quote]Originally posted by FortressMaximus:
We've also learned that while bad animation is somewhat expected, bad writing (like calling your Minicon by the wrong name 3 TIMES!!)
is simply sloppy. The writing on other shows like He-Man is top notch most of the time and the writers can't even get a few characters matched with the correct name??<hr></blockquote>

Just taking a guess here, but I imagine that is more likely a translation issue. I would assume Armada is produced in Japanese and then recorded in english for the western market...

md

EMeadow

11-11-2002, 12:41 AM

[quote]Originally posted by michaelDORAN:
Next fall, Pantheon Books will publish Mythology: The DC Comics Art of Alex Ross, art directed by Chip Kidd with an intro by M. Night Shyamalan. The volume will also feature an original eight-page Superman and Batman comic story by Kidd & Ross and a retelling of Robin’s origin by Paul Dini & Ross.

Book full of Alex Ross DC art with original material? I'm buyin it.
According to the publisher, Road to Perdition creator Max Allen Collins is preparing two graphic novel sequels to the original for DC, one to be drawn by Jose Luis Garcia-Lopez.

Wasn't Marvel originally announced as getting these two projects. Warner Bros. finally give the right apology to Collins for not promoting that they had the comic well just because they missed out on getting the movie rights?
In addition, the Justice League series has been picked up for another season. And Superfriends will begin to be made available on VHS and DVD on 4/22/03.

Superfriends on DVD? Oh yeah, more discs to add and hopefuly get every episode.
The Challengers of the Unknown Volume 2 Archives debuting this spring will test a new, thinner Archive format with a new lower price of $39.95

Thinner format meaning lower prices? Yes please. Should hopefuly give plenty of other books the oppurtunity to get the Archive treatment
Kingdom Come Action Figures are in the works, with figures of Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Superman, Shazam, Magog, Batman, and more in the plans…[/QB]<hr></blockquote>

The Pulse showed pics of some of the prototypes. OH MY GOD........

Jer-el

11-11-2002, 01:15 AM

Whoa. Yes, I just quoted Keanu Reeves (and Joey Lawrence). Whoa. Who do I thank? Where do I start? Thank you michaelDoran. Thank you DC. Thank you Wildstorm. Thank you Vertigo. Thank you Newsarama! 2003 is going to RULE!

11-11-2002, 01:41 AM

(deleted)

11-11-2002, 02:28 AM

[quote] In the middle of the DC hypefest came this bit of toxic fallout:
“One of the great phenomena that I’ve noticed in the last few years is that writers would start their careers in comics and leave, guys like Mickey Spillane and Mario Puzo, who’d go on to fame and fortune,” said Mike Carlin.<hr></blockquote>

...Wow, that's right. Puzo wrote Little Lulu for years, and Spillane wrote and ghost drew both Gasoline Alley and Dondi, and plotted Steve Canyon while Milt Canniff was in the hospital for grins.

[/sarcasm]

Pulps and novels aren't comics, Mike...

Jeremy Williams

11-11-2002, 03:10 AM

Did Time-Warner get suddenly sold tonight? Several quality progects in there...or is that they`ve just hired a new marketing guy? :D

Cormorant

11-11-2002, 03:16 AM

[quote]Originally posted by OM:


...Wow, that's right. Puzo wrote Little Lulu for years, and Spillane wrote and ghost drew both Gasoline Alley and Dondi, and plotted Steve Canyon while Milt Canniff was in the hospital for grins.

[/sarcasm]

Pulps and novels aren't comics, Mike...<hr></blockquote>

Spillane did do some comics work (http://www.comic-art.com/bios-2/spillane.htm), and Puzo wrote (or co-wrote) the script for the first Superman movie. Bit of a stretch to say Puzo worked in comics, but I can see the point, and the Spillane reference seems valid enough.

-Cormorant

EMeadow

11-11-2002, 03:47 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Renaud:
[QB]Alan Scott the Kingdom Come GREEN LANTERN and hopefully Kingdom Come Flash :)

For sure I'm getting those two,

maybe the rest too we'll see how they look,if I see a decent set I might get the whole thing

Go to the Pulse to see prototypes of Superman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, and Hawkman. They all look great.

But I'm just wondering how the hell they'd do a Flash and make him so blurry all the time?

Kurt Busiek

11-11-2002, 04:03 AM

[quote]Originally posted by Cormorant:
Puzo wrote (or co-wrote) the script for the first Superman movie. Bit of a stretch to say Puzo worked in comics, but I can see the point, and the Spillane reference seems valid enough.<hr></blockquote>

The Spillane reference is definitely valid -- maybe he never wrote GASOLINE ALLEY, but he did write Human Torch scripts, and more, for Timely.

Puzo didn't exactly start his career in comics, but he did work for Magazine Management, one of Martin Goodman's many publishing companies. The company published both Marvel comics and men's adventure magazines, and Puzo (and Martin Cruz Smith) worked in the men's magazine division. Stan Lee says Puzo tried to write a comic for him one, for some quick cash, but couldn't do it. Whether that's true or just a good story, who knows -- but Puzo did come out of the Goodman shop, and that's likely what Mike is thinking of.

Robin Green, who's written a lot of SOPRANOS and NORTHERN EXPOSURE, also worked at Marvel -- she was the receptionist there, back in the Sixties. John Jakes did some writing for Marvel, Piers Anthony wrote text stuff for the b&w magazines in the Seventies, Alfred Bester wrote GREEN LANTERN...

kdb

Cormorant

11-11-2002, 04:27 AM

[quote]Originally posted by Kurt Busiek:


The Spillane reference is definitely valid -- maybe he never wrote GASOLINE ALLEY, but he did write Human Torch scripts, and more, for Timely.

Puzo didn't exactly start his career in comics, but he did work for Magazine Management, one of Martin Goodman's many publishing companies. The company published both Marvel comics and men's adventure magazines, and Puzo (and Martin Cruz Smith) worked in the men's magazine division. Stan Lee says Puzo tried to write a comic for him one, for some quick cash, but couldn't do it. Whether that's true or just a good story, who knows -- but Puzo did come out of the Goodman shop, and that's likely what Mike is thinking of.

Robin Green, who's written a lot of SOPRANOS and NORTHERN EXPOSURE, also worked at Marvel -- she was the receptionist there, back in the Sixties. John Jakes did some writing for Marvel, Piers Anthony wrote text stuff for the b&w magazines in the Seventies, Alfred Bester wrote GREEN LANTERN...

kdb<hr></blockquote>

Lessee, and then there's Harlan Ellison, who's written everything from THE INCREDIBLE HULK to BATMAN to comic book adaptations of his own stories, Ray Bradbury who did some stuff for EC, Larry Niven who co-wrote GREEN LANTERN: GANTHET'S TALE with John Byrne, and, hey, let's not forget those delightful two pages that Stephen King contributed to Marvel's well-intentioned but ill-conceived X-MEN: HEROES FOR HOPE charity comic. ;)

By the way, Kurt, I'm ecstatic to hear about the new ASTRO CITY comics on the way. I enjoyed the multi-parters in the original series, but the one-shots were easily the highlights for me, so I'm especially pleased to hear that that's the style you'll be opening with.

-Cormorant

BarryWeen

11-11-2002, 05:30 AM

[quote]Originally posted by Pariah:
Umm, anyone seen my copy of League of Extraordinary Gentlemen Vol. 2 number 4?<hr></blockquote>

It got delayed.

The new shipping date is for December 26.

Issue 5 got moved to January 15.

And issue 6 will probably be solicited in the December Previews for shipment in late February.

MIKEON-LINE

11-11-2002, 06:01 AM

[quote]Finally, DC said a Superman film is in “active pre-production” right now.<hr></blockquote>

Notice how they didn't mention the use of J.J. Abram's much-criticised script. Maybe they're revamping the screenplay? Changing writers altogether? Or have decided that since the use of Abram's screenplay is definite and certain, it no longer needs to be mentioned?

And as for John Cleese's ideas for Superman - JLA/Avengers has just earned itself some competition as my most eagerly-anticipated event book. :)

the4thpip

11-11-2002, 08:27 AM

Midnight, Mass on TV?
Sweet!
I'm a big fan of John Rozum, and I'm glad this is happening for him.
It probably also means that there is life in the franchise beyond the second mini series next year. :)

Mike Cruz

11-11-2002, 10:05 AM

:D

Wow! I guess this is the DC version of the Tet Offensive. I am amazed at the number of great talents they've managed to secure, and the number of great projects that are will be coming up in '03.

Does this qualify Art Spiegelman's comment on 60 Minutes II that "something is underfoot", does anyone have any comment?

BoyWonder

11-11-2002, 12:32 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Mike Cruz:

Wow! I guess this is the DC version of the Tet Offensive. <hr></blockquote>

More like D-day or should that be DC-day. As much as I like new Marvel, I'm a DC boy. This is a really impressive display from DC, who appear to be showcasing some amazing projects.

Kurt Busiek

11-11-2002, 01:53 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Cormorant:
Lessee, and then there's Harlan Ellison, who's written everything from THE INCREDIBLE HULK to BATMAN to comic book adaptations of his own stories, Ray Bradbury who did some stuff for EC, Larry Niven who co-wrote GREEN LANTERN: GANTHET'S TALE with John Byrne, and, hey, let's not forget those delightful two pages that Stephen King contributed to Marvel's well-intentioned but ill-conceived X-MEN: HEROES FOR HOPE charity comic. ;) <hr></blockquote>

True, and there's more along those lines -- I was listing folks like Puzo and Spillane, though, who worked in or around the comics biz before they became big names elsewhere

[quote]By the way, Kurt, I'm ecstatic to hear about the new ASTRO CITY comics on the way.<hr></blockquote>

Glad to hear it!

kdb

swol

11-11-2002, 03:55 PM

Superman channeled by John Cleese.

Who'd a thunk it? :D

Sounds like a hell of a good time.

I'm there.

swol

11-11-2002, 03:59 PM

The Teen Titans animated series is set to debut on the Cartoon Network in 2003, with episodes to be later on Kids WB. DC called the upcoming program “interesting”; as it will be their first “anime-influenced younger-skewing cartoon show.”

I guess now we know why they didn't call the new show Young Justice.

If they can make it as good as Justice League, (BTW: The JL:Savage Time movie was REALLY fun), I'll have to tune in.

daske

11-11-2002, 04:23 PM

Any ideas on why Marvel or any other company for that matter, didn't make a presentation such as this?

Is it because there's such a steady stream of press releases coming out that they don't do it or is a retailer presentation forthcoming?

11-11-2002, 05:03 PM

[quote]Originally posted by michaelDORAN:
And on that note, Carlin said he’s going to be working with Monty Pythoner John Cleese on a Superman comic book. <hr></blockquote>

...I can see it now:

Ma: Here's yoir jugged fish, pa.

Pa: Jugged fish for supper again? Ma, don't we 'ave anything besides jugged fish?

Ma: Wolll...we 'ave Spam, luv. O'll make you up a [CRASSSSSSSSSHHH!!!!] What wos that?!?

Pa: O'll go have a look...whoy, it's a spaceship! It's hit a bishop on the landing!

Ma: Woll...better go see to it, pa, before the Church Police get here.

Pa: Or before the Gumbys run off w'it!

[quote]Originally posted by michaelDORAN:
“John and his partner, Kim Howard Johnson” <hr></blockquote>

...Minor nit: it's Kim "Howard" Johnson.

Tom Daylight

11-11-2002, 05:30 PM

"Don't mention Our Worlds At War!"

egads

11-11-2002, 06:03 PM

WOW!!! Look at all these "new" titles!!! Never heard of Teen Titans, Outsiders, Plastic Man, Authority, Batman projects, or Superman projects before. Geez, aren't there any new ideas out there? Marvel has the same problem. Revamp after revamp using same old names and same old characters. How many times do we really need to see the Outsiders? I really hope Marvel doesn't decide to do a "new" Champions book, I mean they must have learned from Secret Defenders. I am growing tired of this nostalgia driven market. Everything and anything these days have been done before, and I predict they will end abruptly as they ended in the 80's or early 90's. Comics need
new characters and fresh ideas to go bring those readers who are not tied down by decades or years of continuity. I think it's great how comics have their die-hard fans, but comics also need new fans. Don't be handicaped by outdated, old ideas, try come up with new ones, then I'll be excited...

egads

11-11-2002, 06:31 PM

To save my time, and yours, let me explain what I posted. First of all, I am not anti-DC and pro-Marvel like some have accused me of being. I am pro-comics, period. I am not bashing DC in terms of their characters or all of their products, I just have a problem, in general, in seeing companies tease big announcements, only to deliver books that were cancelled and now are "revamped". If you want to have a big announcement, make is something we have never seen before, don't give us the same ol same ol. I have
the same problem with Marvel. You can gift wrap a piece of s**t, but when you open it, it's still a piece of s**t. I am not saying none of these books are good, in fact I think they have top notch talents working on them. I am saying, use those talents and work on something new. People always say don't fix what isn't broke. Than why try to fix something that's always broke?

BuckySinister

11-11-2002, 08:34 PM

Whoo-HOO! Awake the sleeping giant! After all the talent-raiding and chop-busting Marvel's committed against DC this last year or two, I was getting worried. But 2003 looks like a good year for DC at last. I still don't find their core books very appealing, but look at all the cool specials and fringe stuff they're releasing! Fun fun fun...

tralfaz

11-11-2002, 09:07 PM

my brain seriously hurts from all this DC goodness... wish Marvel would give me something... after Origin being the Marvel version of Dark Knight Strikes Back, the only thing I get from Marvel are the New X-Men, Captain America, and The Avengers. All the other Marvel books I get are the TPBs

Fin Fang Foom

11-11-2002, 10:03 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Walt Grogan:
The Kingdom Come action figures sound cool. I hope DC can convince Alan Moore to allow production of the Watchmen figures!

Walt<hr></blockquote>

Alan Moore didn't have any choice in the matter; the decision wasn't his to make! (The merchandising of WATCHMEN has always been a sore point with him.)

DC cancelled the WATCHMEN Action Figures when Alan Moore publicly (and very vocally) declined to participate in the 10th Anniversary celebration of WATCHMEN. (A new reprint of the collected edition, one that would have corrected registration problems and other technical issues that have crept in as the film has aged and been duplicated through the years, was also cancelled.)

Boink182

11-12-2002, 12:32 AM

egads,

DC did mention new books with new ideas and not the same old names. Yes, some are old concepts of super-heroes, but if you don't like those, why don't you just buy the other stuff?

Take a look at Losers. Pick up Fables. Get into 100 Bullets. Warren Ellis has a whole bunch of stuff coming out in different formats.

Even looking at mainstream DCU, did you miss the announcement of Solo? Isn't that what you're asking for? A comic that allows creators to cut loose?

Or do all these new ideas don't count when you just want to rant about lack of innovation in the super-hero genre?

If you want new super-heroes, got buy Image. If you want your old super-hereos with some new ideas, directions, or different takes on them, both Marvel and DC has some of this to offer. If you can't stand traditional super-hero, just don't buy it.

Furthermore, you could just stop buying comics and pick up a book or watch some TV. You want something relevant and different, you could pick up any book by a local author and find something super relevant and modern which probably concerns you if not society in general.

Boo-hoo, my super-hero comics aren't innovative enough :( . Lol. Other genres and media exists.

paulski

11-12-2002, 03:18 AM

Boink speakest much sense.

Daniel Spanky

11-12-2002, 09:10 AM

[quote]Originally posted by: daske

Any ideas on why Marvel or any other company for that matter, didn't make a presentation such as this?
Is it because there's such a steady stream of press releases coming out that they don't do it or is a retailer presentation forthcoming?
<hr></blockquote>

First, please understand that the RRP is an exclusively DC event, so obviously there aren't going to be any presentations by other publishers.

The presentations made at the RRP are long and short advance looks, and allows DC a bit of market testing- they get to see retailer reaction to "themes", forms judgements of what will get retailers enthusiastic, where retailers feel DC's overdone it, so on & so forth.

So it's both a dog & pony show and a market survey. The new product presentation, while extensive, is only a (timewise) minor part of a discussion/meeting that goes on for several days. It's part junket, but it's also a lot of intense work.

Marvel appears not all that interested in feedback, at least feedback that isn't expressed at the till, so they have no need of an event like this. Also they probably can't (or won't) afford it. While the RRP (conservative estimate) cost every retailer that attended about $500-$1,000US, equally this shebang had to have cost DC at the very minimum $25-$30,000. Marvel doesn't have that kind of money to throw around, even if they wanted to.

Equally, they probably don't have the staff. DC had at least a dozen marketing and editorial people there, I doubt that Marvel HAS a dozen such people working for them. You need lots of people to filter in lots of input.

Cliff Biggers, who filed the report to Newsarama is amazing: The guy's sitting there in a darkened room, hammering away on his laptop like a court reporter (he's really that fast), both taking notes on the presentation and preparing questions. He seems to be able to type and participate in discussions at the same time. The amazing thing is that while the data's going in, the comments and questions coming out are cogent, wide ranging, and incisive. Very impressive guy.

spid3y

11-12-2002, 09:57 AM

Hmmmm, no mention of Hunter: The Age Of Magic.

Weird. Will it be cancelled? :(

11-12-2002, 11:41 AM

(deleted)

egads

11-12-2002, 05:56 PM

egads

11-12-2002, 06:06 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Boink182:
egads,

DC did mention new books with new ideas and not the same old names. Yes, some are old concepts of super-heroes, but if you don't like those, why don't you just buy the other stuff?

Take a look at Losers. Pick up Fables. Get into 100 Bullets. Warren Ellis has a whole bunch of stuff coming out in different formats.

Even looking at mainstream DCU, did you miss the announcement of Solo? Isn't that what you're asking for? A comic that allows creators to cut loose?

Or do all these new ideas don't count when you just want to rant about lack of innovation in the super-hero genre?

If you want new super-heroes, got buy Image. If you want your old super-hereos with some new ideas, directions, or different takes on them, both Marvel and DC has some of this to offer. If you can't stand traditional super-hero, just don't buy it.

Furthermore, you could just stop buying comics and pick up a book or watch some TV. You want something relevant and different, you could pick up any book by a local author and find something super relevant and modern which probably concerns you if not society in general.

Boo-hoo, my super-hero comics aren't innovative enough :( . Lol. Other genres and media exists.<hr></blockquote>

Sorry about that. It wasn't meant as an insult or anything, just a numbskull.

Actually, that's the reason I have not bought a comic for over four years. When I collected or read comics, I bought everything regardless of company or company policies. But to me, it got to the point where everything looked the same. There was nothing new, and I realized that I didn't miss that much if I skipped a title for six months, than picked up the latest one. Besides, with a baby now, who has time to read, much less do anything else.

I would like to point out to you, that the article of the Losers mentioned that the book was based on the WW2 comic book with Johnny Cloud, Captain Storm, Gunner and Sarge, and some dog (see I know my DC facts). But I will grant it that the concept and the facet of the book is far different, and realize a title of the book isn't everything (although some can't see that with the relaunch of Thunderbolts).

I would also like to point out that I never once criticized or commented on either 100 Bullets or any of the Warren Ellis projects. I have never read 100 Bullets, but know enough to know that it's quite original (although H-E-R-O compared to 100 Bullets doesn't seem that original). I also know that anything Warren Ellis is quite different from anything I have ever read. However, how many times do we need to see a vanity project concerning Superman, Batman, or Wonder Woman? How many times do we need to relaunch Titans or Outsiders? Geez, it seems like nowadays, everything is either Super, Bat, X, or Spider. On second thought, it's not much different from four years ago.

What I was trying to say is this. Take all these talented people, and put them on projects that are different, and don't be so afraid to fail. Try something different. To me that's the only way the industry will grow. It holds true in other forms of entertainment. People grow tired when they get the same thing over and over. There is a point of oversaturation.

Boink182

11-12-2002, 08:41 PM

egads,

DC is placing that talent on something different. They've got a whole Vertigo and Wildstorm line. I know you didn't critisize anything from these lines, but you aren't praising them either.

However, those books don't sell as much in comic-book stores. This shows that some people still care about super-heroes. Some super-hero fans still might enjoy a book like Titans and Outsiders.

You may have outgrown that stuff. Good for you. Apparently the majority of comic-buyers hasn't yet, though. What is the first non-super-hero book in the top 100?

Dropping in and out of comics, I'm between wanting greater diversity in comics and realizing other medias and genre provide what comics can't give me. However, I'm also realizing what comics do provide--traditional-super-hero-fare--comics do so better than other media.

Even now when so many are saying change-or-die, look at what the movies making millions is based on. Spider Man was nice good old traditional-super-hero-fare. Costumes, origin stories, bad guys, and such...it still has appeal! Didn't Heroclix become the best selling game over the summer? I guess that beats out Magic and Yugi-Oh. What is it based on? Traditional-super-hero-fare.

Maybe this doesn't appeal to you any more, and I think some of it still does because you seem so very pro Marvel witch is all super-heroes. For the fans of some of these characters, this means something, and maybe for new fans as well.

DC isn't doing enough to change the industry? They don't put their best creators on something different? Why do so many people forget the Vertigo and Wildstorm lines?

egads

11-12-2002, 09:17 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Boink182:
egads,

DC is placing that talent on something different. They've got a whole Vertigo and Wildstorm line. I know you didn't critisize anything from these lines, but you aren't praising them either.

However, those books don't sell as much in comic-book stores. This shows that some people still care about super-heroes. Some super-hero fans still might enjoy a book like Titans and Outsiders.

You may have outgrown that stuff. Good for you. Apparently the majority of comic-buyers hasn't yet, though. What is the first non-super-hero book in the top 100?

Dropping in and out of comics, I'm between wanting greater diversity in comics and realizing other medias and genre provide what comics can't give me. However, I'm also realizing what comics do provide--traditional-super-hero-fare--comics do so better than other media.

Even now when so many are saying change-or-die, look at what the movies making millions is based on. Spider Man was nice good old traditional-super-hero-fare. Costumes, origin stories, bad guys, and such...it still has appeal! Didn't Heroclix become the best selling game over the summer? I guess that beats out Magic and Yugi-Oh. What is it based on? Traditional-super-hero-fare.

Maybe this doesn't appeal to you any more, and I think some of it still does because you seem so very pro Marvel witch is all super-heroes. For the fans of some of these characters, this means something, and maybe for new fans as well.

DC isn't doing enough to change the industry? They don't put their best creators on something different? Why do so many people forget the Vertigo and Wildstorm lines?<hr></blockquote>

You bring up very good points, and many of your critiques of me are fair. However, I would like to clear up the point of being very pro-Marvel. Yes, I am pro-Marvel, but I am also pro-DC, pro-Image, pro-good comic period. It only looks like I am very pro-Marvel because I want people to look very closely at their criticism. What they criticize Marvel of doing, DC is guilty of doing the same. The opposite is true also. Whatever good Marvel is doing, DC is doing as well. I have no ill-will to any comic company, and when I was buying comics I based it on the quality of the book, not by who was publishing the book.

I do enjoy super hero comics greatly, but I enjoy comics being around even moreso. If you look at many of the message boards concerning the DC announcements, not many get past page 2, but throw a Thunderbolts revamp and you get 6 pages. Where's the excitement in DC's annoucements? Yeah, some of them look great, but haven't we seen the same every year? How many times do we see a new exciting project by a quality creator only to learn that they are working on Superman, Batman, Wolverine, Captain America.....How many times do we see Cage, Titans, Outsider, Aquaman, try to survive and gain an audience, only to fail but to be relaunched a few months later? This is what I am talking about. It's not about beef with companies, it's about the whole what was old is new theory. You see it with GI Joe, Thundercats, or any 80's cartoon being a comic. Sure it sells for awhile, but like it's predecesor, the pop soon fizzles.

Every one of the creators working on the announced DC projects are top-notch, and many I am a fan of, but personally I don't want to see them doing a vanity project, when they can work on something new and revolutinary. Sure these titles may sell well, but none of them will revolutionize the industry, in a industry that so needs a infusion of new blood and excitement. Remember when the Dark Knight or Watchmen came out? I would like to see these creators, on Marvel's side also, stretch their muscles a bit, and bring something new to the table. A John Cleese written Superman or a text comic of Wolverine doesn't seem to cut it.

Boink182

11-13-2002, 04:07 AM

egads,

Don't worry about DC not getting enough criticism. DC fans are very critical of what happens in that univers.

Marvel has more responses because they have more fans. It's as simple as that. Marvel has Marvel Zombies. These Zombies, moreso than DC fantatics love what Marvel gives them. Yes, many of them hate the changes as well, and that's why you see a ton of negative reaction to some of Marvel's moves.

DC's fanbase is more of the tradtional, old-school fan, and therefore receives heavy complaint, but just not here. Check out the DCMBs...fans are generally not happy. The DC fanbase is also much smaller, so no, you aren't going to see that many long threads about their projects. Unlike Marvel fans, also, DC fans usually hang out at the DCMBs where they may find kindred spirits to discuss obscure favorite characters of years past. They certainly aren't going to find that here...

You've gotta understand though, many people still love these characters. They don't give a damn about the hot new creative teams. That love of the characters actually isn't so bad...

Btw, DC does try to do things that are different. However, you see even smaller threads there. Maybe there aren't enough progressive thinkers who like such comics. Maybe all the so-called progressive thinkers only want progressive super-heroes, and more specifically, their good ol' favorite super-heroes...