OEMING, ROSEMANN ON SPIDER-MAN/RED SONJA

[MattBrady]

<a href="http://www.newsarama.com/marvelnew/SpideySonja/S_Sonjacvr.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.newsarama.com/marvelnew/SpideySonja/sm_vs_rs1_Turner_Cover_t.jpg" border="0" align="right"></a><b>Spider-Man/Red Sonja.</b>

Oh, it’s real – a five issue miniseries starting in August from Marvel and Dynamite Entertainment, written by Mike Oeming, with art by Mel Rubi, starring Spider-Man, Red Sonja, Kulan Gath and the Eddie Brock Venom.

From the outset, it sounds like a fairly nutty idea - <i>he’s</i> a modern-day superhero, swinging through Manhattan. <i>She’s</i> a female warrior of the Hyborian Age, at home in a time a place where the fantastic was real.

Of course, also from the outset for longtime Marvel fans, it has a ring of déjà vu all over again.

We’ll let the Marvel editor of the project, Bill Rosemann explain that aspect.

“When you first hear the title it sounds crazy, but when I’ve mentioned the story to those who know their Marvel history, their eyes light up and they’re like, ‘Oh yeah! Spider-Man and Red Sonja met before – and then Spidey fought Kulan Gath in that cool <b>Uncanny X-Men story</b>!’ So Nick Barrucci of Dynamite, being a huge fan of those stories, approached Marvel about getting Spidey and Sonja back together again. Marvel, seeing how nice <b>Marvel Zombies/Army of Darkness</b> was working out, thought this would be a fun (and a surprisingly natural) follow-up. And when Tom Brevoort asked me to join him as the Marvel editorial consultants on it, I jumped at the chance, because like Nick, I have very fond memories of their previous encounters.”

For Oeming, the writer of Dynamite’s ongoing <b>Red Sonja</b> series, the attraction to the project was a simple one: “I get to write Spider-Man!!!” Though, according to Oeming, getting from point A (agreeing to do it) and point B (doing it) took a little while.

“Nick mentioned it to me, and asked if I wanted to do it, I said ‘sure,’ but I had so much other work both with <b>Sonja</b> and <b>Powers</b> and such, I didn’t really think of it, and I kept it out of my mind knowing that with negotiations and such, it could take forever to happen or not happen at all. Once we got the actual green light, my heart leapt out of my chest – not only do I get to write Spidey, but a Spidey/Red Sonja cross over! It all just added the pressure of making it work so it doesn’t come off silly in any way.”

And adding further to that pressure is that, as Rosemann said, there’s a precedent for these two characters meeting – not to mention that original story being done by two pretty top-notch creators: <b>Marvel Team-Up #79</b>, by Chris Claremont and John Byrne.

<img src="http://www.newsarama.com/marvelnew/SpideySonja/Spidey-Sonja-1970s.jpg" border="0" align="left">Oh – and add to that even more, this miniseries is in continuity, and builds on what’s come before.

“We’re all considering this an ‘in-continuity” story that not only occurs after and follows-up on the events of not only <b>Marvel Team-Up #79</b>, but also <b>Uncanny X-Men #190 - #191</b> the instant classic by Chris Claremont and John Romita Jr. where Kulan Gath transformed Manhattan into a whacked-out version of Hyboria. It featured Spider-Man, the X-Men, the New Mutants, the Morlocks – Kulan crucified Spider-Man in it -- it blew my mind!”

And as for this story? Well, after pretty much having his way with the world in <b>Red Sonja</b>, Kulan Gath sets out to take another bite out of the Big Apple.

“Much like the original, this is about Kulan Gath trying to take over New York,” Oeming said. “He transforms it into a modern Hyboria, much like the <b>Uncanny X-Men</b> issues where he appeared. In the <b>Team-Up</b> issue, it was just Spidey, Sonja and Gath, but here we'll bring in all of Hyboria and a few classic Spidey villains ‘Hyborian style.’ At its heart, this is a love story between Spidey and Mary Jane, with Sonja stuck in the middle. I think that’s ultimately what makes this cross over work, is that its pretty character driven.”

Oh – and that one villain? Technically, according to Rosemann, for continuity watchers, yes, it will be Eddie Brock as venom, but that shouldn’t be taken as a signal that Brock is back in black.

“I’d say the specific time period is a few years ago – because we wanted to include the ‘I want to eat your brains’ Eddie Brock version of Venom.”

Okay, okay – let’s back the bus up here. Time for a little Kulan Gath 101 with Professor Rosemann.

First off, who is he?

“Kulan, a former pupil of Thoth-Amon and a follower of Set, is a power-hungry sorcerer who won’t rest until he’s killed all his enemies and rules all,” Rosemann said. “He’s battled countless heroes again and again in his quest for might. Recently, he returned to life in the pages of <b>Red Sonja</b> and has been causing the crimson-haired warrior all sorts of pain. His followers slaughtered Red Sonja’s family, so she won’t rest until his blood drips from her deadly blade.

“As for this time out, Kulan once again escapes from the necklace that had contained his spirit, and – since he’s one smart and sinister sorcerer – he’s going to prove that he’s learned from his prior defeats. He knows Spider-Man had a hand in defeating him before, so he’s going to target him right away – using a certain She-Devil with a sword!”

And over to Professor Oeming:

“Kulan Gath has found a way to punch into modern day New York once again, he magically transforms the land and the people, polarizing them into their best and worst aspects. In the past, its been established that Spider-Man is immune to this spell for some reason and Mary Jane has a spiritual connection to a very special sword wielded by Red Sonja.”

<i>For even more on Kulan Gath and his previous Marvel history, click here (http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=65838)</i>

And how’s this all a…<i>love story</i> between Spider-Man and Mary Jane, as Oeming said?

Oh, that’s easy – Red Sonja <i>is</i> Mary Jane.

“As with the original story, Mary Jane is transformed into Sonja physically, while the actual Mary Jane is buried deep beneath somewhere in her soul, in danger of being lost forever,” Oeming said. “So its Spidey's job to get Sonja to realize she has this other person inside of her, to awaken MJ within Sonja.... not an easy nor safe task mind you. Eventually, Sonja will figure out what’s going on and she's going to have to make a choice about Mary Jane, one that might cost her her life.... or not, because Sonja is a survivor!”

A survivor for whom, a sudden move to modern-day New York ain’t no great shakes.

<a href="http://www.newsarama.com/marvelnew/SpideySonja/pages2_3.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.newsarama.com/marvelnew/SpideySonja/SpideyRedSonjap2_3_t.jpg" border="0" align="right"></a> “Sonja rolls with the punches,” Oeming said. “It’s hard to vex this woman, and if she is, she won’t show it. She's very focused. She and Spidey do <i>not</i> get along. Once they are forced to fight together, it’s difficult for Sonja to take Spidey seriously because he tends to fight with his tongue as much as Sonja does with her sword!

“But Spider-Man – he <i>can</i> be shaken, and that’s the fun of it. He speaks for the reader, <i>but</i>, he's quick to recover, and his wits keep him centered. And as for his memories about encountering these characters before, blame magic - his past memories are clouded.”

Don’t let Oeming’s initial comments about Spider-Man fool you, though – as the writer himself admitted, he was wigged out when the prospect originally came up.

“When I sat down to do this thing, I called [Brian] Bendis and said, ‘Holy shi<aaa>t, man, I’m writing Spider-Man, what do I do?’ I asked him to read the opening scene for me which had to be a classic Spider-Man fights street thugs scene, and yet it still needs to be special. He liked it and gave me some pointers that I wont reveal - but they were a big help and I have to say, I’m loving writing Spider-Man. Peter Parker is the best, I’d love to play with the character again, especially as a writer. Drawing those webs are a pain!”

And end of the day? What will this miniseries mean for the two?

Rosemann: “Hopefully the story will add yet another fun chapter to their long list of adventures, and like I said, we’re considering this ‘in-continuity’ – so it counts! Our goal is to produce an action-packed and dramatic tale that stands alongside their classic prior meetings. If we can entertain the readers who dug those tales, then we’ve done our job. It’s a high goal to reach for, but both characters and the readers deserve the very best.”

Oeming: “For Red Sonja, you can bet we’re going to see more of the fallout from this story in her own ongoing series.”

[Nobody]

If that art is from the book, looks nice. May get this.

[manou]

Wow, seriously? It reminds me of X-men/Star Trek or Punisher/Archie...

[tiso_spencer]

Seriously what type of thinking goes into a meeting like this? I mean how the hell can people just come up with this crap without breaking a sweat or laughing at the absurdity of it?

[Gladiator X]

Sweet!

As a Marvel Zombie that is totally diggin' the new Red Sonja series this is definitely somethin' I'm gettin'!

[xdemon]

Sounds like fun!

I hope Marvel reprints Marvel Team-Up #79 and Uncanny X-Men #190 - #191 prior to the mini.

[MattBrady]

Seriously what type of thinking goes into a meeting like this? I mean how the hell can people just come up with this crap without breaking a sweat or laughing at the absurdity of it? probably that there's (fondly remembered) historical precedent for it, as mentioned in the article.

MattB

[tiso_spencer]

probably that there's (fondly remembered) historical precedent for it, as mentioned in the article.

MattB

So what? That does not make it any less stupid of an idea to do.

[Scorned1]

Wow, seriously? It reminds me of X-men/Star Trek or Punisher/Archie...

well then you better go back under the bed my friend because from now till the end of summer you'll see alot of crappy team-up books coming like a storm. One of which are Avengers/Transformers and Witchblade/Dorian Gray.

[LIEFELDISGOD]

Not the first time this has happened, so there is some tradition about it.

http://image.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/fullsize/52019311922.79.GIF

[MrGreenGenes]

Is this the extra Marvel preview we were supposed to get today, or is this Spider-Man/Red Sonja thing something else entirely?

[MattBrady]

So what? That does not make it any less stupid of an idea to do. when you run the entire comic book industry, you can make the call. good luck with that.

MattB

[MattBrady]

Is this the extra Marvel preview we were supposed to get today, or is this Spider-Man/Red Sonja thing something else entirely? there's another one coming...

MattB

[LaughingJak]

The goofiness of the idea with modern sensabilities - this could be a really great time! (and that art sure is purty...)

[tiso_spencer]

when you run the entire comic book industry, you can make the call. good luck with that.

MattB

I would hate to run the entire comic book industry when we get dumb retarded ideas like this from people who are supposed to have at least some form of common sense. This is the type of crap that breeds garbage like:

Avengers/Transformers
Superman/Batman vs. Aliens/Predator

I am all for team-ups, that actually make sense. It was the 70s, anything you put in a comic could have gotten away with. This is 2007, why are we still having dumb ideas like this? It is like the same crap when there has to some stupid teen movie every year.

[MrGreenGenes]

there's another one coming...

MattB


Oh, okay. Thanks.

[MattBrady]

I am all for team-ups, that actually make sense. It was the 70s, anything you put in a comic could have gotten away with. This is 2007, why are we still having dumb ideas like this? It is like the same crap when there has to some stupid teen movie every year. y'know, it's your opinion. you've got it, you're holding onto it tightly, so I'll just let it go. Buy what you enjoy. Others will do the same. The existence of things you don't (or have prejudged that you won't) will always continue. Such is life.

MattB

[Nobody]

Wow, seriously? It reminds me of X-men/Star Trek or Punisher/Archie...

Punisher/Archie is one of the greatest comics ever printed.

[skeletorjr]

So what? That does not make it any less stupid of an idea to do.


Please calm down. Are you ever not furious about something? Good grief, relax, they're comic books. If you're going to get this worked up over something you should pick a new hobby.

[Supreme Convoy]

Ya know... Michael Turner does one hell of a Venom...

[Snowspinner]

So what? That does not make it any less stupid of an idea to do.

Dude. We read picture books about men who run around in their underwear fighting crime.

[michaelman9]

covers look great, story seems like fun, i'll at least give it a look

I love that they keep mentioning "in continuity" as if (and often time true) they want people to feel as if it "matters" it'll be fun either way.

[kalorama]

The original MTU issue featuring the two was a classic. But the very thing that made it work and fun to read, namely the sheer absurdity of the idea, makes me wonder if they'll be able to sustain the concept for the entirety of a multi-issue mini. No harm in trying, though. if it works it'll be a fun thing. If not, who does it hurt?

[Bird Flu Man]

Sounds great, especially the "in continuity" part!

But I'm really looking forward to "classic Spidey villains ‘Hyborian style.'"

[tiso_spencer]

y'know, it's your opinion. you've got it, you're holding onto it tightly, so I'll just let it go. Buy what you enjoy. Others will do the same. The existence of things you don't (or have prejudged that you won't) will always continue. Such is life.

MattB

I do not care if is an opinion or not, it is still a stupid idea. For starters, this being an "in-continuity" story already tells me that I have to at least acknowledge it since I do buy Red Sonja to begin with, both old and new series. This is the type of nonsense that will keep being green lighted because people will continue to mindlessly buy anything that has their favorite character on it. You want to know why crappy comics continue to be made, yet stellar books, books that no one ever hears about because they are canned before their time always seem to go? Because people buy this crap over them.

[skeletorjr]

The original MTU issue featuring the two was a classic. But the very thing that made it work and fun to read, namely the sheer absurdity of the idea, makes me wonder if they'll be able to sustain the concept for the entirety of a multi-issue mini. No harm in trying, though. if it works it'll be a fun thing. If not, who does it hurt?

Exactly. Comics can be fun! What a wild concept.

[gland]

There may be precedent and tradition and all, but that honestly isn't enough to go on. If anyone involved really thought this was a cool idea, it wouldn't have taken thirty or fourty years to happen again.


I'm not a fan of doing something just because it's been done before. In comics or otherwise.

[Scarlet Mage]

Gotta agree on the Archie-Punisher. That book was amazing.

[Chris Partin]

I would hate to run the entire comic book industry when we get dumb retarded ideas like this from people who are supposed to have at least some form of common sense.

Are you aware that comics are make believe? Sometimes a comic book comes along that's just absurd in its concept but ends up being fairly entertaining. I'm one of those people that likes to read comics for the entertainment value. This seems like something that might be fun and entertaining. You obviously don't feel that way. Don't read it. Simple as that.

[Scorned1]

Dude. We read picture books about men who run around in their underwear fighting crime.

Don't forget about women with gigantic boobs in skimpy outfits.

I'm talking to you Joe Madruirera. :D

[Chris Partin]

Don't forget about women with gigantic boobs in skimpy outfits.

I'm talking to you Joe Madruirera. :D

Yep. Don't ever forget that. I mean this comic has both, too!

And I liked Battlechasers. :D

[kalorama]

There may be precedent and tradition and all, but that honestly isn't enough to go on. If anyone involved really thought this was a cool idea, it wouldn't have taken thirty or fourty years to happen again.

Not sure that reasoning works. It's been 28 years sine the original MTU story. Since none of the people involved in this story were working in comics 28 years ago, it's reasonable to assume that it's happening now because now is when the people who think it's a cool idea (Oeming, Rosemann, Rubi) are in a position within the industry to get it done.

I'm not a fan of doing something just because it's been done before. In comics or otherwise.

That must severely limit your entertainment options, because truly and completely original stories are generally pretty rare. And comics have a long history of building new stories on top of old ones. It's the what the very idea of continuity is based upon. (Whether that's a good thing or not is another issue.)

[AcidPowerZ]

I hope that's the cover to issue #1 by Turner. That is an awesome image.

[0bsessions]

I do not care if is an opinion or not, it is still a stupid idea. For starters, this being an "in-continuity" story already tells me that I have to at least acknowledge it since I do buy Red Sonja to begin with, both old and new series. This is the type of nonsense that will keep being green lighted because people will continue to mindlessly buy anything that has their favorite character on it. You want to know why crappy comics continue to be made, yet stellar books, books that no one ever hears about because they are canned before their time always seem to go? Because people buy this crap over them.

Honestly, guy, have you EVER read any of the prior instances of this happening? They're classics. I'm not talking about classic in the "they've been around forever" sense, I'm talking classic as in great stories.

To my recollection, this is, AT LEAST, the fourth time Kulan Gath has been involved with the Marvel Universe (MTU, Uncanny X-Men and just a couple years ago in Exiles) and each and every one has been a good story. I would love for you, in your apparent infinite wisdom of what "smart" fans read, to explain to me what is so bloody absurd about revisiting a tested and PROVEN formula? Especially one that's been revisited seldomly enough for it to not be stale yet (Like Days of Future Past, for an opposite example), while being revisited enough to give it a history.

I, for one, am looking forward to this with a great deal of excitement. I can't say as I've ever been huge on Red Sonja in general, but let's get what it has that I DO crave:

Spider-Man: Check
Kulan Gath: Check
The REAL Venom: Big effin' check.

[JRT]

Kulan Gath is technically a Marvel character (I think). He's been part of Marvel Continuity a long time before Dynamite used him. He's already part of Marvel continuity--in fact, I believe the main reason he was used as a RS villain was from Marvel's use of him. (Somebody find out the rights issue).

Marvel always hinted at Conan/RS being part of Marvel's past. It's sort of semi-tied into continuity, even though they don't have the license for either property anymore. It's actually tied in better than stuff like Transformers/Avengers would be.

Gath did come back one time before--Avengers (3rd Edition) #27-29. He killed the goddess Pele and then was sucked into a vortex with the elders he worshipped. I always assumed Kulan Gath was trapped there after that issue.

As far as cross-property stories are...so what? What is so "childish" or "stupid" about such things. It's all imaginary stories anyway!

[tiso_spencer]

Are you aware that comics are make believe? Sometimes a comic book comes along that's just absurd in its concept but ends up being fairly entertaining. I'm one of those people that likes to read comics for the entertainment value. This seems like something that might be fun and entertaining. You obviously don't feel that way. Don't read it. Simple as that.

Comics are make believe? What, really, since when? You pulling my leg. :rolleyes:

And you know what, it is that same mentality that will continue to warp and deteriorate our culture with mindless crap from all forms of entertainment whether it is TV, going to the movie to see the next dumb idea, or books. I am all for accepting the reality of what a comic book is. However, there still needs to be some common sense involved. Does the enjoyability of the comic equal the insanity inside the book or the fact you came away from it feeling good?

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? My Little Pony and the Runaways? Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)? Seriously when is enough enough when it comes to these crossovers?

[skeletorjr]

Comics are make believe? What, really, since when? You pulling my leg. :rolleyes:

And you know what, it is that same mentality that will continue to warp and deteriorate our culture with mindless crap from all forms of entertainment whether it is TV, going to the movie to see the next dumb idea, or books. I am all for accepting the reality of what a comic book is. However, there still needs to be some common sense involved. Does the enjoyability of the comic equal the insanity inside the book or the fact you came away from it feeling good?

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? My Little Pony and the Runaways? Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)? Seriously when is enough enough when it comes to these crossovers?

Why don't you just print out a list of acceptable projects for all the publishers currently doing comics, that way nobody will upset you. I think Wildstorm's got an Authority/Popeye project coming up, we don't want you throwing yourself under a bus.

[Speedball93]

Comics are make believe? What, really, since when? You pulling my leg. :rolleyes:

And you know what, it is that same mentality that will continue to warp and deteriorate our culture with mindless crap from all forms of entertainment whether it is TV, going to the movie to see the next dumb idea, or books. I am all for accepting the reality of what a comic book is. However, there still needs to be some common sense involved. Does the enjoyability of the comic equal the insanity inside the book or the fact you came away from it feeling good?

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? My Little Pony and the Runaways? Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)? Seriously when is enough enough when it comes to these crossovers?
Dude, pull the cobb out of your as$ and quit being so anal. If you don't like it fine, but quit being such a dick about it and move on. There is more to this industry than bitching and moaning every time a creator comes out with something that you don't like. Grow up.

[kalorama]

Does the enjoyability of the comic equal the insanity inside the book or the fact you came away from it feeling good?

If by that you mean does the end (an enjoyable experience for the readers) justify the means (coming up with a story idea that may go against some kind of conventional wisdom), then the (fairly obvious) answer is "yes."

[gwangung]

I do not care if is an opinion or not, it is still a stupid idea. For starters, this being an "in-continuity" story already tells me that I have to at least acknowledge it since I do buy Red Sonja to begin with, both old and new series. This is the type of nonsense that will keep being green lighted because people will continue to mindlessly buy anything that has their favorite character on it. You want to know why crappy comics continue to be made, yet stellar books, books that no one ever hears about because they are canned before their time always seem to go? Because people buy this crap over them.

There are no stupid ideas...just stupid writers.

I enjoy not-stupid writers. They aren't bound by the feeble imaginations and crippled skills of stupid writers.

[speedbaldwin]

I do not care if is an opinion or not, it is still a stupid idea. For starters, this being an "in-continuity" story already tells me that I have to at least acknowledge it since I do buy Red Sonja to begin with, both old and new series. This is the type of nonsense that will keep being green lighted because people will continue to mindlessly buy anything that has their favorite character on it. You want to know why crappy comics continue to be made, yet stellar books, books that no one ever hears about because they are canned before their time always seem to go? Because people buy this crap over them.


Uhm... then maybe you need to be mad at the people who buy them and not the people who produce them. Chill. And how do you know that this won't be a well-written story? Answer: You don't. You can't possibly know that until it comes out. Please shut up and go away now.

[tim seeley]

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? My Little Pony and the Runaways? Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)? Seriously when is enough enough when it comes to these crossovers?

I say, if the creators come up with a good story, ANY crossover is valid. If it's good, and people buy it, who cares? Comics rock because we CAN do this.
TIM SEELEY

[Gokitalo]

And how do you know that this won't be a well-written story? Answer: You don't. You can't possibly know that until it comes out.

Exactly. It seems like a waste of energy getting mad about it at this point.

I say, if the creators come up with a good story, ANY crossover is valid. If it's good, and people buy it, who cares? Comics rock because we CAN do this.
TIM SEELEY

That too.

[gwangung]

<shrug>

It's a very impoverished mind that can reject an idea as inherently bad without looking at the results--particularly when many, many people liked it. It's a mind that has overly stereotyped and limited stories, far beyond what's reasonable. It's the very antithesis of the fertile, imaginative field that is comics.

We don't need to take these poor devils seriously.

[puckett]

Why don't you just print out a list of acceptable projects for all the publishers currently doing comics, that way nobody will upset you. I think Wildstorm's got an Authority/Popeye project coming up, we don't want you throwing yourself under a bus.

dude.

authority/popeye could actually be a pretty good read. i dont know why, but ive kind of assumed popeye as homophobic.... so the miodnighter/apollo tension might really work for character development. oh, and the premise involves the guy who loves hamburgers merging with the bleed or something. oh and he eats the original stormwatch off panel, instead of the aliens, since there's new wildstorm continuity anyway.

man, i hope 'mr. hates everything thats not super serious' didnt read my post.

[defjoe]

I have zero desire to get this and i'm a Spidey and Red sonja fan.

but more power to the people who like it and do get it. It's your $ you can spend it as you wish and no one has a right to tell you how to spend it.

[Jon Snow]

Comics are make believe? What, really, since when? You pulling my leg. :rolleyes:

And you know what, it is that same mentality that will continue to warp and deteriorate our culture with mindless crap from all forms of entertainment whether it is TV, going to the movie to see the next dumb idea, or books. I am all for accepting the reality of what a comic book is. However, there still needs to be some common sense involved. Does the enjoyability of the comic equal the insanity inside the book or the fact you came away from it feeling good?

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? My Little Pony and the Runaways? Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)? Seriously when is enough enough when it comes to these crossovers?


I agree with you whole-heartedly.
Like when Marvel made the MU crossover with the Ultraverse?
Man, was that stupid, or what?
I mean, Conan Vs. Rune??

What were they thinking?

:rolleyes:

[J. Wilson]

Well, the fact that Oeming is doing it is great.

He's doing a great job with the Red Sonja series, and you know that means I just have to get this miniseries as well.

[skeletorjr]

dude.

authority/popeye could actually be a pretty good read. i dont know why, but ive kind of assumed popeye as homophobic.... so the miodnighter/apollo tension might really work for character development. oh, and the premise involves the guy who loves hamburgers merging with the bleed or something. oh and he eats the original stormwatch off panel, instead of the aliens, since there's new wildstorm continuity anyway.

man, i hope 'mr. hates everything thats not super serious' didnt read my post.

Popeye's heart is as open as the Great Outdoors. He will accept Midnighter and Apollo with open arms. The only Bleed will be from Bluto's cracked head

[GenerallZodd]

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? My Little Pony and the Runaways? Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)?

I would totally buy all those. Especially Wolverine meets Alf. That sounds so kick ass.

[puckett]

Popeye's heart is as open as the Great Outdoors. He will accept Midnighter and Apollo with open arms. The only Bleed will be from Bluto's cracked head

nice. .

[bcondray]

Sounds like fun.:D

...just as long as they DO NOT swap costumes at any point in the series.. :eek: :o :D

[Quail-Man]

I do not care if is an opinion or not, it is still a stupid idea. For starters, this being an "in-continuity" story already tells me that I have to at least acknowledge it since I do buy Red Sonja to begin with, both old and new series. This is the type of nonsense that will keep being green lighted because people will continue to mindlessly buy anything that has their favorite character on it. You want to know why crappy comics continue to be made, yet stellar books, books that no one ever hears about because they are canned before their time always seem to go? Because people buy this crap over them.
You haven't even read it yet you goof. Friggin' relax. Flip through it when it comes out or something and give it a fair shake before you cast it aside as crap.

But you're still gonna buy it, aren't you? And you're gonna complain no matter what, right?

[Funkytable]

Sounds like fun!

I hope Marvel reprints Marvel Team-Up #79 and Uncanny X-Men #190 - #191 prior to the mini.

Potentially: Essential Marvel Team-Up Vol 3 will start at issue #52 or #53, and they should go all the way through 79, but maybe not.

PLEASE Marvel, continue the Essential Marvel Team-Up series.

[puckett]

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? My Little Pony and the Runaways? Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)? Seriously when is enough enough when it comes to these crossovers?

my little pony/runaways could work. molly is sick... its all in her head while her team mates try to cure her. she learns a valuable lesson in her head and realizes the answer to some on-gong mystery recently introduced to the series (y'know, build up for the x-over) thanks to the ponies in her dream state.

it really would work.

[zengoth]

...Wolverine meets Alf?

Now I'd read that...

:cool:


And the Uncanny X-Men Kulan Gath arc is one of my all time favorites...

[lfhobbies]

Seriously what type of thinking goes into a meeting like this? I mean how the hell can people just come up with this crap without breaking a sweat or laughing at the absurdity of it?


Yeah I know right - what are they thinking. They must think that comics could be fun and irreverent. Yeah every comic should cater exclusively to the hard core reader that only wants serious books with major social overtones.:rolleyes:

There is room out there for all types of comics and I'm looking forward to this - the X-Men story is one of my favorite arcs. Do I think this story will be on par with Watchmen, probably not, intercompany crossovers don't have the greatest track record. But it looks like fun. Plus as was stated in the article - this book does have ties in Marvel continuity (and was predicted by a couple of us since Sonja 12). So before condemning it read a few pages.

I like what DE is doing as a company trying to establish themselves as a strong independent company and crossovers with Marvel can help that.

[Ace]

I would hate to run the entire comic book industry when we get dumb retarded ideas like this from people who are supposed to have at least some form of common sense. This is the type of crap that breeds garbage like:

Avengers/Transformers
Superman/Batman vs. Aliens/Predator

I am all for team-ups, that actually make sense. It was the 70s, anything you put in a comic could have gotten away with. This is 2007, why are we still having dumb ideas like this? It is like the same crap when there has to some stupid teen movie every year.

I don't know. Because some people like fun comics? And some people like a weird mixing of S&S and Superheroes when there's a good creative team on it. And some people don't need to have everything be realistic and make sense.

[leafinsectma]

...

Too bad you don't like the idea... I love it! I can't wait until this comes out :D

[santino]

my little pony/runaways could work. molly is sick... its all in her head while her team mates try to cure her. she learns a valuable lesson in her head and realizes the answer to some on-gong mystery recently introduced to the series (y'know, build up for the x-over) thanks to the ponies in her dream state.

it really would work.

I'm intrigued...! :)

[protege]

Personally, i'd rather see Spidey teamed with Conan for this one- has he ever?

[chris08]

Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)??

i dont know bout anyone else but id buy that lol

[gland]

That must severely limit your entertainment options, because truly and completely original stories are generally pretty rare. And comics have a long history of building new stories on top of old ones. It's the what the very idea of continuity is based upon. (Whether that's a good thing or not is another issue.)

I agree fully. I've always said that the quality of a story doesn't come from how origional it is, but how you do it this time. But this is rehashing an obscure crossover from 28 years ago...it seems so random to just up and pull this out...and I stand by the idea that if this was something Marvel thought was a great idea based on the success of the first one...well, there wouldn't have been a 28 year gap between them.



Who knows, maybe this'll be an awesome comic. I don't know. But crossovers need to be held to a higher standard than an average issue of an average book. I think that because while it's easy to write a good issue and tell a good story about any character, crossovers rarely come down to just that. When big name character A and big name character B show up in the same special, it tends to become more about the spectacle of two big name characters being in the same issue together. I can never go back and re-read any old DC/Marvel crossovers because almost every time, story quality is suplimented by "hey look, Spider-Man is on the same page as Batman! Cool!!!". So when they dig up an old crossover concept that hasn't been used for decades, seemingly out of nowhere, I'm going to be skepticle about not only the potential quality, but the reason behind the editorial decision to go through with it.

[0bsessions]

Here's an example for some of the doubters, hopefully a few of you are video games:

Anyone here ever heard of Kingdom Hearts? It was this ridiculously stupid idea. Someone decided it made sense to mix child-friendly Disney characters and themes with Squaresoft's more adult Final Fantasy series and characters.

It was critically panned and fans laughed it off, thinking it was a joke of a game in the making and would be in bargain bins in a week, this was all before even the first screen shots popped up. I myself wrote it off, thinking a big, fat "WTF, mate?!"

Then it hit stores and was a massive hit. It was just...so damn good. I would've been more impressed, but I do a lot of walking, so my foot didn't taste particularly good shoved so far in my mouth.

Also, to this day, I still think Spider-Man Vs. Powdered Toast Man was a classic of my youth.

[EmeraldGuy32]

this is gonna rule.

[0bsessions]

I would totally buy all those. Especially Wolverine meets Alf. That sounds so kick ass.

Better yet, Beast meets Alf. Alf eats cats, after all...

Foight of da centurai!

[Horror Punk]

Guys, we need to calm down. Brain eating Eddie is back. We should be rejoycing, not getting mad. we sould all be praying to the lord almighty. Thanking him for bringing our beloved Eddie back. Praise JEEZUS!

....Religion makes people comfortable.

[Marcdachamp]

I would hate to run the entire comic book industry when we get dumb retarded ideas like this from people who are supposed to have at least some form of common sense. This is the type of crap that breeds garbage like:

Avengers/Transformers
Superman/Batman vs. Aliens/Predator

I am all for team-ups, that actually make sense. It was the 70s, anything you put in a comic could have gotten away with. This is 2007, why are we still having dumb ideas like this? It is like the same crap when there has to some stupid teen movie every year.
Y'know what I love? When some mindless jerk calls a story that hasn't been published yet crap. Before you start criticizing things you haven't read, why don't you focus on what you have and build a case from there? Your ignorance is exactly the type of thing that scares people away from comic forums.

[Kolimar]

Hopefully, it'll be as fun as the original story. :)

[kalorama]

I agree fully. I've always said that the quality of a story doesn't come from how origional it is, but how you do it this time.

And, based on that (very reasonable) observation, what basis do you have for panning this, given that you have no idea how well it'll be done this time?

But this is rehashing an obscure crossover from 28 years ago...it seems so random to just up and pull this out...and I stand by the idea that if this was something Marvel thought was a great idea based on the success of the first one...well, there wouldn't have been a 28 year gap between them.

That's like saying if the iPod was such a great idea, why didn't someone think of it years ago. What difference does it make when it happens? I'll stand by by idea that it only takes one inspired writer, one inspired artist, and one inspired editor to make it work. This book may well have all three and the reason it's taken them this long is because they weren't in a position to do it before. That and the very obvious fact that, before now, Red Sonja wasn't really a viable enough commercial commodity to warrant such a return.


But crossovers need to be held to a higher standard than an average issue of an average book. I think that because while it's easy to write a good issue and tell a good story about any character, crossovers rarely come down to just that.

Every book worth reading comes down to a good story about a character, regardless of who the characters are.
So when they dig up an old crossover concept that hasn't been used for decades, seemingly out of nowhere, I'm going to be skepticle about not only the potential quality, but the reason behind the editorial decision to go through with it.

Again, it's not out of nowhere. it's pretty obvious how this sprung up. Spider-Man is Marvel's most popular character, undergoing a resurgence of public profile as a result of the films and his role in Civil War. The Red Sonja comic is a good seller with a some positive buzz. Those two things weren't true 10 years ago, thus the reason it's happening now. And it doesn't take much detective work to figure that "the reason behind the editorial decision to go through with it" is the same as the reason for everything else they publish: Because they think/hope (a) it'll entertain/gratify enough people that (b) it'll sell a lot of copies and (c) make money. What effect does that path to creation have on whether the book will be any good? Absolutely none, really.

[Jeffrey D. Smith]

this being an "in-continuity" story already tells me that I have to at least acknowledge it since I do buy Red Sonja to begin with, both old and new series. This is the type of nonsense that will keep being green lighted because people will continue to mindlessly buy anything that has their favorite character on it.
So, if this were out of continuity you could ignore it, but if it is in continuity you have to mindlessly buy it?

[gland]

kalorama, instead of searching my posts for talking points to rebut against, look at what I said overall. I already said that it could very well be something good, but it's a crossover. When we get right down to it, crossovers tend to be bad more often than they're good. All of a sudden doing a sequal to something from 28 years ago is just flat out an odd thing to see. That plus the general stigma of crossovers in general...can you seriously not understand my stance? Seriously?

[Kolimar]

I would totally buy all those. Especially Wolverine meets Alf. That sounds so kick ass.

I couldn't agree more. :D But I prefer Superman vs. Goku. That would truly rawk!! :D :D The most fitting too, considering the influence Superman had on the creation of Goku. ;)

[Kolimar]

One more for The Complete List of Inter-Company Crossovers. Do you own any? (http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=43303) :p :D ;)

[Typhon24]

Uh...DAMN, that interior shot is sweet. Is that Mel Rubi? That shot's stunning.

[Liliaeth]

I would totally buy all those. Especially Wolverine meets Alf. That sounds so kick ass.

Hell, if Alf shows up, Beast should better start hiding, considering that it seems like they mostly draw him cat like these days.

[Chris Partin]

I say, if the creators come up with a good story, ANY crossover is valid. If it's good, and people buy it, who cares? Comics rock because we CAN do this.
TIM SEELEY

Exactly! I think that's what's great about comics. I think there are too many people care too much about what everyone outside of comics thinks about what they see when they take a moment and look at what's going on in comics. Like I said before, I care about entertaining books.

Tim - I loved Hack Slash/Chucky! Great stuff.

[kalorama]

kalorama, instead of searching my posts for talking points to rebut against, look at what I said overall. I already said that it could very well be something good, but it's a crossover. When we get right down to it, crossovers tend to be bad more often than they're good. All of a sudden doing a sequal to something from 28 years ago is just flat out an odd thing to see. That plus the general stigma of crossovers in general...can you seriously not understand my stance? Seriously?

Instead of getting bent out of shape because I disagreed with you, look at what I said overall. Can you seriously not understand that I understand your stance but think it has no real merit and clearly spelled out why in specific terms? Seriously?

What "stigma" to crossovers? Are all crossovers inherently awful? Nope. And even if that argument had any legs, it wouldn't have any in this case because you're talking about two characters who, it's already been proven, can be successfully teamed in a story together. This is not uncharted territory.

You keep bringing up the time frame between the original story and this followup like it has some heavy meaning. It has none. If they'd done the story 15 years ago would that make it better, more worthy, easier to understand? No. It'd just make it 15 years earlier. They're doing the story now because they can and because they want to. It's that simple, no matter how "odd" it may seem to you.

Not everything is a conspiracy. Sometimes a comic book is just a comic book.

[Sano]

Sounds great, can't wait!

P.S. - I hope they stick my homeboy Shuma-Gorath in there, even as a cameo. The story of him in the Hyborian Age vs. Conan is great stuff.

It was cool that Shuma-Gorath's name was used as a password to get into Dr. Strange's crib in New Avengers, and I was hyped seeing him again in Marvel Nights 4 last year. ^_^

[pop monkey]

That's a sweet Venom on the cover. I have to admit that Turner is improving, as an artist. If only he'd let somebody ink his covers, they might look pretty nice.

[gland]

Instead of getting bent out of shape because I disagreed with you, look at what I said overall. Can you seriously not understand that I understand your stance but think it has no real merit and clearly spelled out why in specific terms? Seriously?


Dude, I'm not trying to argue with you. You're acting like because I'm not embracing this thing, it means I'm some enemy that needs attacking. And there's absolutly no need to come back at me in the sarcastic and immature way you just did.


This is what I said, pure and simple:


Crossovers tend to be bad the majority of the time...so I tend to have less faith in crossovers in general...this is essentially a sequal to a crossover that they didn't think was a good enough idea to do again for three decades...and all of a sudden here it is...that seems weird to me. So what I'm left with is the question of why they chose to all of a sudden up and do this again, followed by the stigma that because it's a crossover it has less chance of being any good. Basically, the fear that this will end up being more a marketing thing than just a good story.





EDIT: What "stigma" to crossovers? Are all crossovers inherently awful? Nope. And even if that argument had any legs, it wouldn't have any in this case because you're talking about two characters who, it's already been proven, can be successfully teamed in a story together. This is not uncharted territory.

Majority of the time, a crossover event turns out to ride the specticle of two or more popular characters who aren't usually in a book together being in a book together. One could probably count on one hand the number of crossovers that are actually good stories, and not just "Oh man, it's character A and character B! OH MAN NOW THEY'RE FIGHTING! Oh, they stopped in the middle to team up and fight some weird pairing of their respective villians". Crossovers, in my experience, are almost always about the very fact that these characters are apearing together, and not so much about the actual story quality.



You keep bringing up the time frame between the original story and this followup like it has some heavy meaning. It has none. If they'd done the story 15 years ago would that make it better, more worthy, easier to understand? No. It'd just make it 15 years earlier. They're doing the story now because they can and because they want to. It's that simple, no matter how "odd" it may seem to you.

Not everything is a conspiracy. Sometimes a comic book is just a comic book.

You're jumping the gun. By a lot. I'm not suggesting comspiracy. I'm saying that if they thought this was such a good idea, why would they wait 28 years before doing it again? This is a business, and if they thought it'd be a good move, they would have done another a few months or a year down the line. Or even a few years down the line. But three decades? Come on.

[MR2525]

That Michael Turner / Peter Steigerwald cover is amazing!!! AAAAMMMMMAAAAZZZIIINNNNG!!! Best Venom I have seen in a long long time. You guys rock:p

[DarkJared]

Wow, seriously? It reminds me of X-men/Star Trek or Punisher/Archie...

Nah this is a natural crossover with history. This is a follow-up that works off actual spider-man continuity. I love this kind of crossover.

[kalorama]

Dude, I'm not trying to argue with you. You're acting like because I'm not embracing this thing, it means I'm some enemy that needs attacking. And there's absolutly no need to come back at me in the sarcastic and immature way you just did.


This is what I said, pure and simple:


Crossovers tend to be bad the majority of the time...so I tend to have less faith in crossovers in general...this is essentially a sequal to a crossover that they didn't think was a good enough idea to do again for three decades...and all of a sudden here it is...that seems weird to me. So what I'm left with is the question of why they chose to all of a sudden up and do this again, followed by the stigma that because it's a crossover it has less chance of being any good. Basically, the fear that this will end up being more a marketing thing than just a good story.

I'm not attacking you. I was just disagreeing with you. You're the one who seemed personally put out by it all.

I understood your point the first time. And, like the first time, the second time you posted it it still doesn't hold up to scrutiny. The fact of the matter is (as has been pointed out in this thread) that Marvel did at least two sequels to the story, one in the X-Men a couple of years after the original and another in the Avengers a couple years into Busiek and Perez's run. The time gap you keep harping on as proof of the story's illegitimacy is bogus because they clearly did think the idea was good enough to follow up on, because they did, in fact, follow up on it at least twice before now.

And the fact that it may have marketing implications does not, in any way, preclude it from being a good story. You're jumping to conclusions based on nonexistent evidence.

[Cyberleader]

I would hate to run the entire comic book industry when we get dumb retarded ideas like this from people who are supposed to have at least some form of common sense. This is the type of crap that breeds garbage like:

Avengers/Transformers
Superman/Batman vs. Aliens/Predator

I am all for team-ups, that actually make sense. It was the 70s, anything you put in a comic could have gotten away with. This is 2007, why are we still having dumb ideas like this? It is like the same crap when there has to some stupid teen movie every year.


Why are these writers and such doing things that are original or unexpected!?!? Why can't they have wolverine fight the hulk for the nine billionth time instead?!

Also congratulations on managing to combine the narrow mindedness of constraining the limits of story-telling with artificial 'genre' boundaries with the snot nosed arrogance of saying THIS IS 2007 AND OUR COMIC BOOKS I MEAN GRAPHIC NOVELS ARE VERY SERIOUS BUSINESS THAT NEED TO BE TAKEN VERY VERY SERIOUSLY. That's some serious bad-idea alchemy there.

[kalorama]

I'm saying that if they thought this was such a good idea, why would they wait 28 years before doing it again? This is a business, and if they thought it'd be a good move, they would have done another a few months or a year down the line. Or even a few years down the line. But three decades? Come on.

You can keep writing it, but it won't take on any more meaning or significance. The fact that it's been 28 years since the original story gives no meanigful implication as to whether this will be a good story. None. You're wildly jumping to conclusions based on nothing of substance. And, again, there are obvious practical reasons why there haven't been more crossovers between the character since then. The most obvious being that for most of the past 28 years Marvel hasn't had the publishing rights to Red Sonja and no one else was publishing the character in comic form.

[gland]

I'm not attacking you. I was just disagreeing with you. You're the one who seemed personally put out by it all.

I understood your point the first time. And, like the first time, the second time you posted it it still doesn't hold up to scrutiny. The fact of the matter is (as has been pointed out in this thread) that Marvel did at least two sequels to the story, one in the X-Men a couple of years after the original and another in the Avengers a couple years into Busiek and Perez's run. The time gap you keep harping on as proof of the story's illegitimacy is bogus because they clearly did think the idea was good enough to follow up on, because they did, in fact, follow up on it at least twice before now.

And the fact that it may have marketing implications does not, in any way, preclude it from being a good story. You're jumping to conclusions based on nonexistent evidence.


Yeah, nonexistant evidance. The fact that basically every crossover tends to be crap must not count for anything. Or the fact that it seems odd to bring back an obscure one that a lot of people aren't going to remember the first (or more) installment of.







You can keep writing it, but it won't take on any more meaning or significance. The fact that it's been 28 years since the original story gives no meanigful implication as to whether this will be a good story. None. You're wildly jumping to conclusions based on nothing of substance.

The entire point of mentioning the time gap was "HEY, ISN'T IT WEIRD THAT THEY ALL OF A SUDDEN ARE DOING ANOTHER OF THESE AFTER 28 YEARS?". And since comics is a business, they would have done more sooner if they thought it was successful enough to warrant doing again. The fact that they waited so long to do it makes me wonder how they came to the conclusion to even do it at all.

[kalorama]

Yeah, nonexistant evidance. The fact that basically every crossover tends to be crap must not count for anything. Or the fact that it seems odd to bring back an obscure one that a lot of people aren't going to remember the first (or more) installment of.

...but at this point there doesn't seem to be much use in trying to talk to you about this. I thought I could have a mature talk about an impending comic with other fans, and I have no interest in this kind of immature back and forth.

The entire point of mentioning the time gap was "HEY, ISN'T IT WEIRD THAT THEY ALL OF A SUDDEN ARE DOING ANOTHER OF THESE AFTER 28 YEARS?". And since comics is a business, they would have done more sooner if they thought it was successful enough to warrant doing again. The fact that they waited so long to do it makes me wonder how they came to the conclusion to even do it at all.


The only reason it's a back and forth is because you keep saying the same thing over and over without making any attempt to actually address the arguments against your point. As for immature ... putting the same point you've made 4 times already in ALL CAPS isn't going to gain it any more creedence or relevance. Yes, it's been 28 years since the first one. And, again, so what? It means nothing to anyone but you.

As I've said multiple times, the reason they decided to do it now is because there's a new Red Sonja comic being published that is fairly popular. Some people (including, apparently, the writer and editor) fondly remember the original team-up and are enthused by the idea of revisiting it again. Given the current popularity of the two characters, both publishing houses think that there's a market for the story now. Nothing "weird" about it. It should be fairly obvious to anyone who looks at the circumstances with an objective eye and open mind, which you clearly lack.

[gland]

The only reason it's a back and forth is because you keep saying the same thing over and over without making any attempt to actually address the arguments against your point. As for immature ... putting the same point you've made 4 times already in ALL CAPS isn't going to gain it any more creedence or relevance.

As I've said multiple times, the reason they decided to do it now is because there's a new Red Sonja comic being published that is fairly popular. Some people (including, apparently, the writer and editor) fondly remember the original team-up and are enthused by the idea of revisiting it again. Given the current popularity of the two characters, both publishing houses think that there's a market for the story now. Nothing sinister or underhanded about it. It should be fairly obvious to anyone who looks at the circumstances with an objective eye and open mind, which you clearly lack.

God, just look at you. You're so determined to make your point and make the other guy look stupid, it's uncanny. First you come back at me with immature repitition, then you say I lack an open mind...how about just talking? Without digs, or snide remarks, or trying to get the end-all last word in, or trying to one-up the other guy?

[Sano]

IMHO crossovers are only bad when they involve Marvel and DC except for a few exceptions like Batman and Captain America. It's 'cuz they try to make everyone happy and have stuff that defies logic like Wolverine beating up Lobo(fans who voted for Wolvie to win are stupid), Batman beating up Carnage and crazy stuff like that. Maybe it's just me but I see Marvel and DC as being way too different for this kind of thing to actually work, Teen Titans and X-Men and Avengers JLA are some of the standouts, but I don't think Supes can beat up Thor in 2 pages lol!

But this is one that has worked in the past, so no big.

Avengers / Transformers sounds like a dumb concept but it also seems like it could be fun, to me anyway. I'll check it out.

Hyborian Spidey villains in this story? How about Doctor Shuma-Gorath-opus, Doc Ock plus Shuma-Gorath, lol!

[pop monkey]

And you know what, it is that same mentality that will continue to warp and deteriorate our culture with mindless crap from all forms of entertainment whether it is TV, going to the movie to see the next dumb idea, or books. I am all for accepting the reality of what a comic book is. However, there still needs to be some common sense involved. Does the enjoyability of the comic equal the insanity inside the book or the fact you came away from it feeling good?

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? My Little Pony and the Runaways? Superman vs. Goku: The Greatest Comic Ever (12 issues)? Seriously when is enough enough when it comes to these crossovers?

Dude, I have to conclude that you are either a giant asshole who just likes to punish himself by being so "passionate" about a genre you clearly don't enjoy. Seriously, you're in the wrong hobby, pal. Stick with Top Shelf, Fantagraphics, etc, but my God, get away from the superhero thing -- it clearly isn't to your taste. Too much whimsy and fun for you I guess. I am very confused by your apparent liking of the Ultraverse, as evidenced by your avatar and banner -- that universe was certainly not free of the kind of idiocy you imagine to be at work here. In addition to being an asshole, I guess this makes you a very forgetful idiot as well? Either way, we're done with you. Please go somewhere else, and for the love of creation stay away from comics and find something you enjoy -- I suggest sitting on a park bench somewhere by yourself yelling personal insults at complete strangers.

[Lambert]

I would hate to run the entire comic book industry when we get dumb retarded ideas like this from people who are supposed to have at least some form of common sense. This is the type of crap that breeds garbage like:

Avengers/Transformers
Superman/Batman vs. Aliens/Predator

I am all for team-ups, that actually make sense. It was the 70s, anything you put in a comic could have gotten away with. This is 2007, why are we still having dumb ideas like this? It is like the same crap when there has to some stupid teen movie every year.

by comparing the superman alien crossover... it makes me think that you believe that superman alone is not a radical story. Do you not agree that the concept and mythology behind superman is some of the most ridiculous and just flat out laughable story making ever to make it into the popular eye?

with that said... this crazy- son of jurel concept has spun out some amazing storylines, and has proven itself... in both the story telling field AND the money making one.

this idea (spiderman/red sonja) is *just* as bizarre as the spaceman-come-to-earth-has-xray-vision-and-laserbeams one.

give it chance, or let it slide by
so say we all.

[ziza9]

I do not care if is an opinion or not, it is still a stupid idea. For starters, this being an "in-continuity" story already tells me that I have to at least acknowledge it since I do buy Red Sonja to begin with, both old and new series. This is the type of nonsense that will keep being green lighted because people will continue to mindlessly buy anything that has their favorite character on it. You want to know why crappy comics continue to be made, yet stellar books, books that no one ever hears about because they are canned before their time always seem to go? Because people buy this crap over them.

One of the best Spiderman stories took place in two issues of the Uncanny X-men book back in the 80's. Spidey, heck the whole Marvel U present within a barrier surrounding Manhattan island mixed with Kulan Gath and his ilk. It was a fascinating story that was fun to read. Who's to say that this one won't be the same?

[Sano]

Here's an example for some of the doubters, hopefully a few of you are video games:

Anyone here ever heard of Kingdom Hearts? It was this ridiculously stupid idea. Someone decided it made sense to mix child-friendly Disney characters and themes with Squaresoft's more adult Final Fantasy series and characters.

It was critically panned and fans laughed it off, thinking it was a joke of a game in the making and would be in bargain bins in a week, this was all before even the first screen shots popped up. I myself wrote it off, thinking a big, fat "WTF, mate?!"

Then it hit stores and was a massive hit. It was just...so damn good. I would've been more impressed, but I do a lot of walking, so my foot didn't taste particularly good shoved so far in my mouth.

Also, to this day, I still think Spider-Man Vs. Powdered Toast Man was a classic of my youth.

Hell yeah KH rocks! That joint is better than the CGI Disney movies and the cheap-quels they are putting out today. KH2 was one of the highest selling games of '06 too.

Also loved all of the Marvel vs. Capcom games starting with X-Men vs. Street Fighter and ending with Marvel vs. Capcom 2. There are still Marvel vs. Capcom 2 tournies held to this very day. Sure, Marvel in a story is waaaay stronger than Capcom characters, but they gave the Capcomers super jumps and hyper fireballs to help them out at least ha ha ha!

If you want to read Superman vs. Goku since someone mentioned that, check out the very last comic book issue of Dragon Ball Z, before they went over to Shonen Jump and had their story released in manga books only. In the very last issue Viz printed a very funny fan fic story of Superman meeting up with Goku, really hilarious!

[Enigma20XX]

probably that there's (fondly remembered) historical precedent for it, as mentioned in the article.

MattB

There is? Welll whatdyakowboutthat?

And if she doesn't flirt with him at least ONCE, I'm gonna be sorely disappointed...

But in all seriousness... how can you keep up with all the crap they're putting Spidey through?!?!?

[gland]

Gotta love Newsarama. The articles are top notch, but the threads are no better than any other crappy comic MB. Disapointing doesn't cover it. I'm going back to reading just the articles and not bothering with the threads, again.

[Sano]

Ha ha knew it was him but I had to look this up to make sure. Kulan Gath tried to revive Shuma-Gorath in Conan's comic, that story was great! Man I hope Shuma-Gorath gets a cameo in this story. :)

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix2/shumagorath.htm

[Bearpod91]

Gotta love the Venom from Turner.

[JLAJRC]

What is next? Wolverine meets Alf? ?

I'd prefer Tigra/Alf instead. :cool: :p :D

[weaselwelch]

This mini looks like it will be cool. Can't wait.

And for those of you who are bashing on this even before you've seen it. Kinda makes me wonder, if your this hard on a comic before you even see it, i have to wonder how you act about people you don't know and think are stupid.

[EMeadow]

Sounds like fun!

I hope Marvel reprints Marvel Team-Up #79 and Uncanny X-Men #190 - #191 prior to the mini.

Definitely. I said it over the weekend. Reprint the stories in a 0 issue please. The buyers of the single issues would like to enjoy this as well.

We know you're gonna put them in the trade,

[EMeadow]

Don't forget about women with gigantic boobs in skimpy outfits.

I'm talking to you Joe Madruirera. :D

Don't talk to him! You'll cause the books to be even later! :D

[Andy E. Nystrom]

I have to agree with the people who loved Archie Meets the Punisher. In fact, while it hasn't been updated in many years, I actually created a website with annotations for the comic. And yes, there are legitimate reasons for annotating this book. There are <b>a lot</b> of references to old teen comics in it.

http://victoria.tc.ca/Recreation/Comics/AP.html

[Saint Zero]

Dude. We read picture books about men who run around in their underwear fighting crime.

Bravo, Sir.

Or Madam, the title is vauge. :D

[gwangung]

God, just look at you. You're so determined to make your point and make the other guy look stupid, it's uncanny.

Well...he really didn't have to work very hard to do that.

Tell you what...make his job harder. LISTEN to what he says. :rolleyes:

[I.M.C.]

I'll most likely be picking this one up. I mean, so far with Darkman Vs. Army of Darkness and Marvel Zombies Vs. The Army of Darkness Dynamite has been two for two in hitting it out of the park with thier crossovers so far. And this one is not a first between these two characters anyway. Spidey and Kulan Gath already share a history in two fan favorite tales. , so what's the problem with them meeting again ? While I never read the original stories, I hope to get hold of them when I visit the local comic shop again. Besides I'm tweaked to see what a Hyborian-Era Venom would look like.

[Sano]

Went back into my old comics and re-read X-Men 190-191. Very cool stuff seeing Manhattan turn into the Hyborian Era. Captain America was the man, he had Conan's build with long blond hair, a sword and the same shield. Can't wait for this mini series! August is too far away...

[Enigma20XX]

Don't talk to him! You'll cause the books to be even later! :D

Dayumn... is he still working on one?

[Kelby]

Red Sonja vs Red Monica??? That would be boobalisious!!!! I say get Joe Madruirera on the phone. Tell him to put down the video game and pick up a pen.

I motion somebody starts a new post titled "Where in the world in Joe Madruirera?"

I don't have anything to say about crossovers but thats because I can't think of any outstanding crossovers.

Good Luck!

[Sano]

Joe Mad is working on Ultimates 2 for Marvel, which should come out... one of these days...

He's also working on finishing the latest Final Fantasy game ha ha ha!

Red Monica had a background cameo in the first issue of Street Fighter, he drew the Ryu vs. Sagat mini story, that's the last I've seen of her...

[katapult]

when I first heard this, my initial reaction what that it would suck donkey balls....but since Oeming is writing it, I will definately give it a try. sounds like he had a lot of fun writing it so that is a plus. :)

-Kat

[0bsessions]

Joe Mad is working on Ultimates 2 for Marvel, which should come out... one of these days...

He's also working on finishing the latest Final Fantasy game ha ha ha!

Red Monica had a background cameo in the first issue of Street Fighter, he drew the Ryu vs. Sagat mini story, that's the last I've seen of her...

Considering I figure you mean Ultimates 3 (As there's only one issue of 2 left), I believe it's actually 4 that he's working on. At least Marvel's smart enough to give Joe Mad like two years of lead time. It'll probably still hit some snags, considering his abysmal track record.

[skl183]

this could have been a whole lot worse but its passable.

And please, when will they stop it with Kulan Gath junk?

Its not like Sonja doesn't have other villains to fight!

[ziza9]

Considering I figure you mean Ultimates 3 (As there's only one issue of 2 left), I believe it's actually 4 that he's working on. At least Marvel's smart enough to give Joe Mad like two years of lead time. It'll probably still hit some snags, considering his abysmal track record. With all the delays to Ultimates 2 and the already massive lead time he's had, shouldn't there be more than maybe 3 and 1/2 issues in the can?

[fazeforce]

I just gotta put my two cents in on this: my first Uncanny X-Men comic when I was a kid was #191 off of a spinner rack, part two of the Kulan Gath storyline. The splash page was a tattered and bloody Spidey being crucified. I was 9 years old, and had no idea who the X-Men were or what the Hell was going on, all I know is that Spidey died during the course of the story (thanks for that time meddling, Dr. Strange!) I was so disturbed, yet hooked.

I picked up the Marvel Team-Up between Spidey and Red in a Marvel Tales reprint a year or so after that and loved it. I implore any doubters to go back and read these stories.

And while you're at it, pick up What If? Volume One #43 - what if Conan were stranded in the 20th century. He fights Cap, my friends - and it friggin' rocks. One of my favorite comics in my 25 years of collecting. Cool Seinkiewicz cover, too. All great stories that need to be read.

Okay, that was more like a dime's worth - sorry...

http://www.comicvine.com/comic/what-if/2918/23995/&i=1442

[Sano]

Hey I'd love to read Cap vs. Conan! Especially after rereading X-Men 190 - 191 where Cap was a lot like Conan ha ha! I know a store that has lots of goodies in their back bins, I'll check for that and the Marvel Team Up issue. Thanks man! :)

Say, isn't there a Hulk vs. Conan story too?

[Superboy]

http://i3.tinypic.com/2cgxxkj.gif
Red Sonja has jumped the shark.

[Sano]

Cool image there! :)

I'm glad that this story will be a love story between Peter and Mary Jane since it looks like they are about to go through the ringer in future 616 comics... will be nice to visit a happier time. :D

[kitty_tc]

Yeah, nonexistant evidance. The fact that basically every crossover tends to be crap must not count for anything..

Actually it means nothing at all, your logic is fatally flawed. Specifically, the inference of a trend in unrelated items. Essentially, you're like the gambler who erroneously believes a good roll of the dice is "due" because the last several have been bad, when the odds of each die roll are completely unaffected by the results of previous rolls. Similarly, this story is unaffected by other ones who may share surface similarities to it. If any story has any affect on this one, and that only minimally, it's the original MTU issue and the related X-Men follow-up, all of which were very good. And while their quality doesn't prevent an inferior sequel from being produced, it does provide good material to build on for the current creative team.

It's painfully obvious that the detractors never read the original stories this is being based on, or they'd never choose the baseless epithets they have, and the ignorance is equal parts amusing and annoying. Honestly, some people need to learn what the hell they're talking about before rushing for the "reply" button.

[skl183]

Wow, good away to take a kind of okay idea and turn it upside down. MJ = Sonja...now I've seen it all.

The regular series is going down the crapper, hope issue 25 changes but I have doubts. And the one-shots are few and far between this year. They were great last year but I have a feeling my good luck wouldn't last long and it looks I'm right.