MARVEL's X-MEN PANEL LIVE! FROM LA

[MattBrady]

<a href="http://www.newsarama.com/WWLA_07/Marvel/x_men.html"><img src="http://www.newsarama.com/WWLA_07/Marvel/sat/x-men-200-bachalo_t.jpg" Border="0" align=right></a>We're calling it a weekend now that Marvel wrapped up its final WWLA program of the con, a panel focusing on the <b>X-Men</b> corner of their universe.

Here's our report, along with preview art from the panel (below).

<I>On site resporting by Albert Ching</i>

Marvel writers, editors, and otherwise manning that panel are Jim McCann, C.B. Cebulski, Chris Gage, X-Men editor Andy Schmidt, Craig Kyle, Chris Yost and Peter David. Ed Brubaker, who is running late, is scheduled to join them on the dais soon.

<b>Uncanny X-Men</b> was the first title mentioned, teasing the return of both Salvador Larroca and Storm to the title.

Click <a href=http://www.newsarama.com/WWLA_07/Marvel/x_men.html>here</a> for the full story...

[si, rodrigo]

Is there anyway to see the pics without the Marvel logo? I can't see Anole :(

[donkeypuncho]

I want that widescreen XMEN finch picture as a full blown poster. No, I don't want.. I DEMAND.

[Somebody]

Interesting - the Finch XM200 cover appears to have had some colour revisions (Magneto's fist is now glowing, for one thing). And Wolverine's front & centre on BOTH XM200 covers despite not being on that lineup...

Skottie Young C/D cover's still crap, but at least now we know what issue it's FOR...

Is that a tweaked Storm costume, or are the bare upper legs a %^&*-up? What's she doing on the [Uncanny] X-Men [cover] anyway, isn't she meant to be off in space or the zombieverse or something with the F4?

Other than that, seemingly a round of pose/lineup covers, with XF20 possibly worst of breed (exc the SKottie covers, of course), since Madrox and M, especially, are barely recognisable.

[durkadurka]

I want that widescreen XMEN finch picture as a full blown poster. No, I don't want.. I DEMAND.
Agreed. I want to be able to see and identify everybody on that picture, dammit!

[MadTrendy]

"Chris Claremont will make his long-delayed debut on Exiles soon, which was teased on a slide."


Ummm....

[Somebody]

Agreed. I want to be able to see and identify everybody on that picture, dammit!
Bigger version, with - as I mentioned - seemingly earlier colouring: http://wizarduniverse.com/_images_/003777/X-Men200color.jpg

Very Background: Phoenix Force ("Phoenix" at the front is therefore Jean c. UXM354-380)

Leftmost group (foreground):

Back: Husk
Next level: Lady Mastermind, Mystique, Lockheed, Shadowcat
Behind: Dani, Polaris
Foreground: Sabretooth.

Next group (background):

Flying: Angel/Archangel, Cannonball, [Omega Sentinel?], Banshee
Back (high): Revanche, Joseph, [Changeling]
Near: Chamber

Next group (foreground):

Back: Iceman
Foreground: Bishop, Juggernaut, Rogue, Psylocke, White Gambit, Rachel, Havok
Front: Beast

Next group (front cover):

Flying: Sunfire, Storm
Next: Cable, Scott, Jean
Front: Wolverine

Next group (background):

Flying: Slipstream, Lifeguard, Northstar
Back row: Forge, [Looks like Exiles Mimic, I suspect a bad reference and it's meant to be MU Mimic], Sage, Marrow, Maggott, [Presumably intended as Ceclia Reyes, but the hair's wrong]
Next down: Jubilee
Next: Deadly Genesis team (Darwin, Sway, Petra, Vulcan)

Last-but-one-group (middle ground)

Back: Longshot, Dazzler
Next: Colossus, Frost
Front: Nightcrawler

And finally, far right:

Back: Xorn
Next: Xavier
Front: Magneto

[CaptainCanad]

So has Chris Claremont not been writing the last few issues of Exiles that have his name on them?
"Is Storm going to play a bigger role in X-Men?" Brubaker, who was distracted by texting his wife about his encounter with Kristen Bell, eventually answered "I think she's going to be in the book for the foreseeable future, as far as I know."
So, Storm's going to be on the Fantastic Four and the Uncanny X-Men and continue as a supporting character/co-lead in Black Panther at the same time? I await the orgy of complaints that greeted Wolverine's multiple books/memberships, but I suspect it won't happen.;)

[theodoros2]

First Class looks like X-Men: The early years.

John Byrne will loooove it!!

Will Exiles visit a world that Captain America won the civil war?
That could be a good idea.

[durkadurka]

Bigger version, with - as I mentioned - seemingly earlier colouring: http://wizarduniverse.com/_images_/003777/X-Men200color.jpg

Very Background: Phoenix Force ("Phoenix" at the front is therefore Jean c. UXM354-380)
...

No no no, what the hell? I didn't want to be told! I wanted to use my x-tensive x-knowledge!

[SpaceButler]

Given the way Scott has been acting lately in Astonishing, Bishop might just soon have a bullet hole in the back of the head to match that neat face tatoo.:D

[durkadurka]

Flying: Angel/Archangel, Cannonball, [Omega Sentinel?], Banshee
Back (high): Revanche, Joseph, [Changeling]
Near: Chamber



You totally forgot Stacy X next to Revanche...not that that's necessarily a bad thing, mind you.

[PHEEL]

Oh, how I wish back to the simpler days of when there was ONE X-Men title.... how I enjoyed those days... I NEVER thought I would drop this title. I absolutely loved the characters... albeit I am thinking of those from the 1980's/1990's. I just couldn't keep up with all the many MANY titles and the way the characters were written from how Chris Claremont originally portrayed them to people who were completely out of character and, unfortunately, those I care nothing about now. I still can't believe Storm married the Black Panther.

I'd love to get back into the X-Men, but what title should I be looking to? Like I said, I haven't read the title for a good couple of years - although I'm still with The Astonishing X-Men (and the Emma Frost I grew up with would never have joined the X-folk!) and I don't know if I'm missing out on anything. Please anyone... am I?

I'll never forget the feeling I had when I read the story of Jean Grey's funeral.... the first one. Those were the X-Men I always hark back to...

[bebopeva88]

Given the way Scott has been acting lately in Astonishing, Bishop might just soon have a bullet hole in the back of the head to match that neat face tatoo.:D

You know what? I would LOVE to see that. :D

[ROBRAM89]

Claremont on Exiles...judging by the number of comic fans who are blinded by nostalgia versus the number that give a crap about actual quality of writing, sales should SKYROCKET!

[Kolimar]

Chris Claremont will make his long-delayed debut on Exiles soon, which was teased on a slide.

Finally. :D :)

[Somebody]

You totally forgot Stacy X next to Revanche...not that that's necessarily a bad thing, mind you.
You're quite correct - I'll edit my post in a few minutes :)

"Any plans for future Age of Apocalypse books?" Schmidt: "I love that stuff. I'm looking. I want to find a way."
Please God NOOOOooo....

The AoA ended in X-Men Omega. The "10th Anniversary" *spit* series missed the point, not only of that, but by having the whole thing "back to normal" in A YEAR and then having Phoenix (After the beautiful narration over Jean's last moments)... eugh.

It missed the point by so much, here's your point: •, and somewhere around Pluto-Charon is where AoAX hit.

[si, rodrigo]

So the storm cover is for Uncanny 487.... Do we know what that arc is about?

[Kolimar]

X-Men First Class will relaunch in June as an ongoing series.

Sounds like they had a nice success with that to launch yet another X-Men title. :D

[Kolimar]

The panel was then opened up to Q&A, with Ed Brubaker finally showing up, saying he was delayed because he was giving Veronica Mars star Kristen Bell a signed copy of Captain America #25.

Well done, Ed!! :D Lucky bastard... :mad: :mad: :mad: :p :D ;)

[Somebody]

So the storm cover is for Uncanny 487.... Do we know what that arc is about?
Morlocks. Or rather, depowered Morlocks, apparently.

[Kolimar]

"When Scarlet Witch said no more mutants, does that mean no more future mutants?" Schmidt: "That does appear to be the case," as of the recent X-Men Annual.

Crap... Sigh...

[Kolimar]

Brubaker, who was distracted by texting his wife about his encounter with Kristen Bell, eventually answered

I'd like to know what she told him. :mad: :mad: :mad: :p :D

[<sage>]

No to Storm on Uncanny
No thanks to Larocca returning, I love the guy's work but it hasn't been the same since leaving X-Treme X-Men and he's done enough work on X-titles, I'd rather see more Billy Tan, Clayton Henry and Ramos. Besides that, I'm really liking what I'm hearing about this impending crossover (my poor wallet!)

Doesn't it make some sense to have an appearance by Jean/Phoenix? Phoenix disinfects evolutionary dead end's (Sublime). The fact that there are no more mutants makes them an evolutionary dead end and could very well face the judgment of the Phoenix.

[AdamYJ]

Sounds like they had a nice success with that to launch yet another X-Men title. :D

Good thing, too. It's one of the most entertaining, fun, baggage-free X-Men books you can read. Scoff if you must. However, I have to tell you, it's really nice to read Jean Grey in a series without all that Phoenix stuff.

[Beyerstein]

X-Men First Class will relaunch in June as an ongoing series.

'cause that's what we really needed

[Somebody]

However, I have to tell you, it's really nice to read Jean Grey in a series without all that Phoenix stuff.
AGREED!!!!

[The Guvnor]

"Will Wolverine Origins ever be good?"

Ha ha, kudos to that person as it's a very good question to ask. :D

[The 'Nam]

MORE X-STATIX!!!!!

That's all that interests me in the X-universe right now.

[<sage>]

'cause that's what we really needed

I'm sure John Byrne will be thrilled :p :D

[PhoenixFacto]

I agree with the poster at the top that said these marvel.com logos on all the art is annoying and i feel disrespectful to the artist. It covers up their work and frankly it sucks. We all know its marvel, why must they be so in your face with it?

Storm is officially the new wolverine - Black Panther, Fantastic Four, and Uncanny? Damn. Wolverine is only in Wolverine, Origins, and New Avengers at this point.

[Kolimar]

"How can there still be a school with so few mutants?" McCann: "That'll be touched on in the Endangered Species one-shot."

The school has had even fewer mutants. :p :D ;)

[CaptainCanad]

Wolverine is only in Wolverine, Origins, and New Avengers at this point.
And Astonishing; although it hardly ever comes out.

[durkadurka]

I agree with the poster at the top that said these marvel.com logos on all the art is annoying and i feel disrespectful to the artist. It covers up their work and frankly it sucks. We all know its marvel, why must they be so in your face with it?

Storm is officially the new wolverine - Black Panther, Fantastic Four, and Uncanny? Damn. Wolverine is only in Wolverine, Origins, and New Avengers at this point.
As well as Astonishing...if that even counts anymore.

[Kolimar]

I'm sure John Byrne will be thrilled :p :D

Heh, I was thinking about The Hidden Years. Ouch...

[Somebody]

I'm sure John Byrne will be thrilled :p :D
Why? - the only similarity between the approaches to XMFC and XM:tHY is that they're both set in the past. XMFC is a light read with every issue a "done in one", lots of guest stars and a "light" approach to continuity - it's nodded to, but that's about it.

XM:tHY was an interminable mess of a series that took forever for any plot to get anywhere and tried to insert gratuitous Storm and Phoenix [Force] crap before they actually came about in the books.

[ROBRAM89]

http://www.newsarama.com/WWLA_07/Marvel/sat/x-men_first_class_1.jpg

Artists take note, THAT is how you draw Sue Storm. Less Lee, more Linsner.

[AdamYJ]

AGREED!!!!

Yes! I am not alone. I started reading X-Men during the '90s, and while that era had its flaws, one thing I liked is that all that Dark Phoenix stuff was behind us. Back then, Phoenix wasn't anything but a codename, and not one that Jean used for much of the decade.

The school has had even fewer mutants. :p :D ;)

Yeah, remember when it was okay to just have about eight students? It was a small, intimate class. It was easy to meet with the Professor and discuss problems. I bet those kids learned a lot. :p

Heck, one thing I keep wondering is why the school in Westchester never took back the "School for Gifted Youngsters" title. They gave it to the Massachusetts Academy for Generation X, but never took it back even when that book was cancelled and the Westchester school actually was filled with Gifted Youngsters. I mean "Xavier Institute for Higher Learning" doesn't really work anymore, considering they're not really trying to pass themselves off as a University anymore.

[PhoenixFacto]

Does that mean we are getting Jean back but she won't be the Phoenix? I hope so! Just bring back Jean she doesnt need to be the Phoenix.

[ROBRAM89]

They need to go ahead and name it Radio City Mutant Hall.

[Somebody]

Yes! I am not alone. I started reading X-Men during the '90s, and while that era had its flaws, one thing I liked is that all that Dark Phoenix stuff was behind us. Back then, Phoenix wasn't anything but a codename, and not one that Jean used for much of the decade.
Yeah, at that point Rachel was Phoenix - and then Alan Davis wrote the Phoenix Force out - PERMANENTLY [and Rachel herself was written out shortly after Davis left Excalibur, and then killed as an old woman in the far future to tie things off]. Unfortunately, later writers [*cough*Morrison*cough*], refused to let a by-then maggot-ridden corpse lie, and decided arbitrarily that Jean was Phoenix despite 15 years of "Jean isn't Phoenix" stories...

[ZEBULON]

Am I the only one that wants jean grey back no matter how?

[AdamYJ]

Yeah, at that point Rachel was Phoenix - and then Alan Davis wrote the Phoenix Force out - PERMANENTLY [and Rachel herself was written out shortly after Davis left Excalibur, and then killed as an old woman in the far future to tie things off]. Unfortunately, later writers [*cough*Morrison*cough*], refused to let a by-then maggot-ridden corpse lie, and decided arbitrarily that Jean was Phoenix despite 15 years of "Jean isn't Phoenix" stories...

Oh, is that how it went. I didn't know much about Rachel at the time. Excalibur was kind of the "bastard step-child" of the X-Men universe during the '90s. Looking back to the '80s, it was awesome, but it just wasn't a big player during the '90s. Also, I only had a subscription to Uncanny X-Men and no access to a shop.

[<sage>]

Why? - the only similarity between the approaches to XMFC and XM:tHY is that they're both set in the past. XMFC is a light read with every issue a "done in one", lots of guest stars and a "light" approach to continuity - it's nodded to, but that's about it.

XM:tHY was an interminable mess of a series that took forever for any plot to get anywhere and tried to insert gratuitous Storm and Phoenix [Force] crap before they actually came about in the books.

Yes, that's why I picked the name :p ;). Why you ask? Because John Byrne is a psycho! :D :p And that tiny similarity is most likely enough to send him into self destruct :p I'm actually pleasantly surprised First Class is becoming an ongoing, the sales haven't been very good.

[motteditor]

The panel was then opened up to Q&A, with Ed Brubaker finally showing up, saying he was delayed because he was giving Veronica Mars star Kristen Bell a signed copy of Captain America #25.

*jaw drop* As if she weren't fabulous enough. If only she were Jewish ... and, you know, had a clue that I even exist. : )

"Is Storm going to play a bigger role in X-Men?" Brubaker, who was distracted by texting his wife about his encounter with Kristen Bell, eventually answered "I think she's going to be in the book for the foreseeable future, as far as I know."

How many books is she going to be in?

"Will Illyana stick around?" Yost: "You'll have to read to find out."

I don't think they could give any other answer, but man, I hope she does.

"Callisto. She'll have two arms, two legs."

Thank goodness.

A fan who clearly did not enjoy X-Men 3 asked the panel how they felt about it. McCann quipped, "Hey, we sat through Elektra." Brubaker: "X-Men 3 or Batman & Robin, come on, what would you rather watch?"

Good point.

"Scarlet Witch appeared in New Avengers, so is she going to be in any of the X-books coming up?" McCann: "Maybe."

You know, if there's any chance that character can be redeemed, I think it's probably in X-Men. It's also probably with another identity, but that may just be me.

Firestar? McCann: "Firestar retired."

*sigh*

Any more 12-parters on Uncanny? Brubaker: "No, and I'm sorry for pacing it a little slow at the beginning, but the last two issues are five issues worth of violence."

Good nes. I've enjoyed the story, but it's definitely starting to wear on me. I'm ready for the next thing.

[<sage>]

Am I the only one that wants jean grey back no matter how?

No, I'm right there with you. You'd think the sales and critical reception of Endsong and Warsong would warrant some more attention to Jean. I gotta disagree with Schmidt, Jean dying and coming back as Phoenix isn't tirying its the dying part that is, its totally unnecessary Planet X could have ended with her leaving to join those other Phoenix's - without her death that is (obviously)

[Kolimar]

Wolverine: Origins was up next, with a slide showing the impending return of '90s Wolverine villain Cyber.

Wasn't he dead? :confused: :p :D .

[ROBRAM89]

RE Morrison ignoring all that 90's Phoenix crap:

Ignoring a massive web of pointless, confusing retcons isn't bad writing.

[Somebody]

Oh, is that how it went. I didn't know much about Rachel at the time. Excalibur was kind of the "bastard step-child" of the X-Men universe during the '90s. Looking back to the '80s, it was awesome, but it just wasn't a big player during the '90s. Also, I only had a subscription to Uncanny X-Men and no access to a shop.
Excalibur... the issues between the Claremont/Davis and Davis-solo runs varied from "forgettable" to "awful". The Davis solo run [#42-67, exc some fill-ins] was "awesome" :), although only two of the scattered fill-in issues in that run [#57-58] were even half-decent (Lobdell did his worst work on any book ever on his Excalibur fill-ins, of which there were quite a few before, during and after the Davis run; with those two the only ones with redeeming features). After Davis left, the book's quality fell off a cliff within a page, and I haven't read the later Ellis issues, which are supposedly decent.

RE Morrison ignoring all that 90's Phoenix crap:

Ignoring a massive web of pointless, confusing retcons isn't bad writing.
What "90s Phoenix crap"? It was in the background of Excalibur, with only Exc #48-50, 52 & #62-65 focusing on it in any way [the latter three as a subplot, designed to write it out for good]. Other than that, the Phoenix was A COMPLETE NON-ISSUE during the 90s. Get your facts straight.

[Bleh]

With all this talk about Magneto coming back, I still have an ounce of hope that Polaris won't stay in space. But with Storm on Uncanny now, the chances of Polaris staying around are small.

Ok, being honest, I'll feel cheated as a fan if he leaves Lorna in space. But, I'm staying optimistic, that soon we'll get a story about Lorna's mother/Magneto, or we learn about her new powers, or a reunion with Magneto... as his daughter. I hope.

:(

[CaptainCanad]

Brubaker keeps mentioning her Apocalypse-powers, so I assume he has something in mind.

[ROBRAM89]

Unfortunately, later writers [*cough*Morrison*cough*], refused to let a by-then maggot-ridden corpse lie, and decided arbitrarily that Jean was Phoenix despite 15 years of "Jean isn't Phoenix" stories...

OK, whenever THAT stuff happened. I've read the explanation of the whole Phoenix history on Wikipedia, and I still don't understand it, and that's the condensed Reader's Digest version of it. I feel weird just saying these words, but Morrison made things a hell of a lot simpler.

[Corrupteddragon]

Im hoping this next x crossover is going to be good and get me to really WANT to read xmen titles again. I still pick them all up, but most are out of habit really. Besides X-factor, i dont think any of them are consistently good on a monthly basis. I used to LOVE the x line, but now i think im diging the Avengers line even more. Im hoping that they really get something going so that i WANT the next X issue to come out.

[Somebody]

OK, whenever THAT stuff happened. I've read the explanation of the whole Phoenix history on Wikipedia, and I still don't understand it, and that's the condensed Reader's Digest version of it. I feel weird just saying these words, but Morrison made things a hell of a lot simpler.
Define *How* he made things simpler, please?

[Eoghann]

Define *How* he made things simpler, please?

He made Jean Grey dead.

You don't get much simpler than that.

[cookepuss]

Im hoping this next x crossover is going to be good and get me to really WANT to read xmen titles again.
Not that this has/hasn't been suggested, I'm thinking that this whole "Endangered Species" thing is just a prologue for the big thing. I mean REALLY big.

Let's consider one thing. The event isn't starting until later in the year. Right? Why? Is it just something to do with WWH occupying the current publishing landscape? Partially, but I suspect that it's because, in a little more than a year from now, Uncanny X-Men hits its 500th issue. It'd be a shame if Marvel's next X-event didn't somehow coincide or conclude with #500.

We're 15 issues away. Sounds like a lot, right? Well, Marvel plans well in advance. Plus, with WWH probably not wrapping up until the very end of the year, the next X event could conceivably wrap up just in time for #500. A milestone like that almost never comes around nowadays. Marvel has repeatedly said that BIG things are on the horizon for the X-universe, I believe them. Any other time, I'd call shenanigans. Not this time.

I'm thinking that ES is just a nice warm up. Now way would Quesada not plan this thing far enough in advance. Only one shot to get it right.

I know that it seems unreasonable ponder such an issue a year in advance, but you've gotta believe that they've addressed this in their summits. If I've thought about it...

[Tiger47]

interesting things to note:

Scott is back in his visor in all of these images.

Emma is the only member of the AXM team not on the X-Men cover...

And endangered species is running only as back-ups? not much of a crossover in that case :rolleyes:

[Kolimar]

I'd like to know what she told him. :mad: :mad: :mad: :p :D

As a matter of fact, I'd like to know what she told him that he had to tell his wife about immediately... :eek: :p :D ;)

[Kevinjohncon]

I saw a Phil Jimenez Spider-Man piece recently. Now this 2 p. X-Men spread. Wassup with that? I thought he was a DC exclusive.

[Tiger47]

I saw a Phil Jimenez Spider-Man piece recently. Now this 2 p. X-Men spread. Wassup with that? I thought he was a DC exclusive.

Jimenez's contract expired and he's started doing some work with marvel, especially spider-man related stuff.

[Somebody]

He made Jean Grey dead.

You don't get much simpler than that.
And yet, Jean hadn't been the Phoenix since she was brought back from her death in UXM100 in FF :)

It was Morrison who **tied Jean herself into** the Phoenix Force.

[Kevinjohncon]

Thanks '47.

[Eoghann]

And yet, Jean hadn't been the Phoenix since she was brought back from her death in UXM100 in FF :)

It was Morrison who **tied Jean herself into** the Phoenix Force.

Actually what he did was reverse about 2 decades worth of messy retcons and the continuity mess that created.

Jean Grey was linked to the Phoenix force and she's dead, just like she should have stayed after the Dark Phoenix saga. Of course they're already screwing all that up again, but since this is comics that was inevitable.

Never the less I'd say Morrison's angle was definitely simpler than what had come before.

[Somebody]

Actually what he did was reverse about 2 decades worth of messy retcons and the continuity mess that created.

Jean Grey was linked to the Phoenix force and she's dead, just like she should have stayed after the Dark Phoenix saga. Of course they're already screwing all that up again, but since this is comics that was inevitable.

Never the less I'd say Morrison's angle was definitely simpler than what had come before.
What you deliberately miss is that all the other stuff is still there and irreconcilable. You CAN'T "reverse" this stuff, it doesn't work like that and never has - notice how all the pre-Crisis cruft gradually leaked back into Superman over the course of twenty years, even when it was far more thoroughly nuked than what Morrison did to Phoenix.

All you're doing is saying "IT'S SIMPLER, IT'S SIMPLER" when nothing you say proves it, but instead points out that he just added a layer of cruft on what was already there.

[si, rodrigo]

I saw a Phil Jimenez Spider-Man piece recently. Now this 2 p. X-Men spread. Wassup with that? I thought he was a DC exclusive.
I'm not familiar with his work. Which one is Jimenez?

[CaptainCanad]

interesting things to note:
Scott is back in his visor in all of these images.

That doesn't mean anything; AXM's story takes place whenever it finishes, so it'll be post-WWH, and post-crossover for all we know.

Emma is the only member of the AXM team not on the X-Men cover...
She's to the right of Jean.

And endangered species is running only as back-ups? not much of a crossover in that case :rolleyes:
It's not the crossover, it's the buildup to the crossover.

[ROBRAM89]

What you deliberately miss is that all the other stuff is still there and irreconcilable. You CAN'T "reverse" this stuff, it doesn't work like that and never has - notice how all the pre-Crisis cruft gradually leaked back into Superman over the course of twenty years, even when it was far more thoroughly nuked than what Morrison did to Phoenix.

All you're doing is saying "IT'S SIMPLER, IT'S SIMPLER" when nothing you say proves it, but instead points out that he just added a layer of cruft on what was already there.

People bring back the stuff they like. You make it sound like it's a force of nature, like everything tends toward what used to be. "Nature abhors a retcon," basically. Taking Krypto away only goes away if people want Krypto to come back. If, say, YOU write X-Men, you can undo Morrison's stuff if you want, but you're the only person I've heard complain about this, so I doubt it's going to go back to normal any time soon unless osmebody literally FORGETS he changed any of it and puts it back in completely on accident. Which actually seems more likely.

[AdamYJ]

Actually what he did was reverse about 2 decades worth of messy retcons and the continuity mess that created.

Jean Grey was linked to the Phoenix force and she's dead, just like she should have stayed after the Dark Phoenix saga. Of course they're already screwing all that up again, but since this is comics that was inevitable.

Never the less I'd say Morrison's angle was definitely simpler than what had come before.

It may be simpler in some ways, but it's also generally unnecessary. You really didn't need to know a damn thing about the Phoenix to understand Jean when I was first reading comics. It was brought up occasionally, but it was also something left largely in the past. There was really no need to bring the Phoenix back at all in my opinion.

Plus, there's the fact that I just don't like the Phoenix.

In fact, I'm going to come right out and say it, I didn't really even care for the original Dark Phoenix Saga. It was overhyped. They explained too much at the end with the Watcher and that Recorder guy. And the death scene meant nothing to me (I know what you'll say. "If she had stayed dead, the death scene would have meant something". Well, I don't care. She came back and it meant nothing to me. I'm a '90s X-Fan, so deal with it). The best thing that came out of that story was the introduction of Kitty Pryde. Jean should have stayed alive and that freakin' bird should have stayed dead except maybe as a simple codename.

[ROBRAM89]

I'm not familiar with his work. Which one is Jimenez?

Drew Infinite Crisis. And some of New X-Men. I don't particularly care for him.

[Nate28]

COME ON JEPH LOEB!!


BRING BACK X-MAN!!!!

[Phoenix Phan]

Am I the only one that wants jean grey back no matter how?


I'm right there with ya. And for all of those who would say: "Dear God! Don't bring her back again!" Shush. I'm tired of everybody always wanting their favorite character back, but I can't have mine. But Marvel, please, don't bring her back until after World War Hulk. I don't need Jean showing up and getting killed (again) by falling debris!

[si, rodrigo]

That doesn't mean anything; AXM's story takes place whenever it finishes, so it'll be post-WWH, and post-crossover for all we know.

She's to the right of Jean.

It's not the crossover, it's the buildup to the crossover.


That's not the image he's talking about. He's talking about the one that I think is drawn by Bachalo.


Drew Infinite Crisis. And some of New X-Men. I don't particularly care for him.

Sorry, I meant which one is the 2 pg spread by Jimenez that he was referring to?


I just wanted to add that at this point I don't think anyone is dying at the end of the Astonishing arc. If someone was going to die that that would be perfect for the funeral in the one shot. And yeah I know, the arc isn't done by the time the one shot is released, but they could have worked something out. Also in the in the cover I think is drawn by Bachalo Colossus and Kitty are both there, and I think they were the most probable to die. Even though Emma isn't on that cover I'm going to go on a limb here, and say she doesn't die either.

[AdamYJ]

I'm right there with ya. And for all of those who would say: "Dear God! Don't bring her back again!" Shush. I'm tired of everybody always wanting their favorite character back, but I can't have mine. But Marvel, please, don't bring her back until after World War Hulk. I don't need Jean showing up and getting killed (again) by falling debris!

I'm okay with her coming back. I just want her to leave that bloody cosmic bird wherever she was. :D

[Somebody]

People bring back the stuff they like. You make it sound like it's a force of nature, like everything tends toward what used to be. "Nature abhors a retcon," basically. Taking Krypto away only goes away if people want Krypto to come back. If, say, YOU write X-Men, you can undo Morrison's stuff if you want, but you're the only person I've heard complain about this, so I doubt it's going to go back to normal any time soon unless osmebody literally FORGETS he changed any of it and puts it back in completely on accident. Which actually seems more likely.
I ask you - what percentage of retcons which are more than ten years old have genuinely stuck? By which I don't necessarily mean "haven't been reretconned" (since it's rare for a retcon to be prominently undone, but common for it to be silently undone - either by someone trying to pull a fast one, through simple ignorance or through the effects of a retcon being undone without the actual retcon itself being changed), but actually, actively stuck so that they continue to influence current comics.

It's not a force of nature, but it's nearly as inexorable as writers and editors try to make things the way they liked them.

It may be simpler in some ways, but it's also generally unnecessary. You really didn't need to know a damn thing about the Phoenix to understand Jean when I was first reading comics. It was brought up occasionally, but it was also something left largely in the past. There was really no need to bring the Phoenix back at all in my opinion.

Plus, there's the fact that I just don't like the Phoenix.

In fact, I'm going to come right out and say it, I didn't really even care for the original Dark Phoenix Saga. It was overhyped. They explained too much at the end with the Watcher and that Recorder guy. And the death scene meant nothing to me (I know what you'll say. "If she had stayed dead, the death scene would have meant something". Well, I don't care. She came back and it meant nothing to me. I'm a '90s X-Fan, so deal with it). The best thing that came out of that story was the introduction of Kitty Pryde. Jean should have stayed alive and that freakin' bird should have stayed dead except maybe as a simple codename.
*agrees with pretty much every word this guy just said*

[CaptainCanad]

I just wanted to add that at this point I don't think anyone is dying at the end of the Astonishing arc. If someone was going to die that that would be perfect for the funeral in the one shot. And yeah I know, the arc isn't done by the time the one shot is released, but they could have worked something out.
Since the point of the funeral isn't to focus on the specific mutant being buried, but on what one less mutant means, having it be a main castmember wouldn't serve that purpose.

Again, since the AXM arc is still in the future, it doesn't matter who's on what cover of X-Men.

[Adam Geen]

Anyone know who drew the pic with Blink, Sabretooth, Longshot etc....?

Purple background, signed with just a T.

Thanks

[ZEBULON]

TO everyone who has a problem with jean dying and coming back . . .HELLO, she's the phoenix, that's kinda what phoenix's do. They die and come back over and over again. Thats kinda the whole point.

So come on guys, bring her back, she's like marvel's wonder woman.

[TheUUShadow]

REALLY big.


Well, Marvel plans well in advance. Plus, with WWH probably not wrapping up until the very end of the year, the next X event could conceivably wrap up just in time for #500. A milestone like that almost never comes around nowadays. Marvel has repeatedly said that BIG things are on the horizon for the X-universe, I believe them. Any other time, I'd call shenanigans. Not this time.

I'm thinking that ES is just a nice warm up. Now way would Quesada not plan this thing far enough in advance. Only one shot to get it right.

I know that it seems unreasonable ponder such an issue a year in advance, but you've gotta believe that they've addressed this in their summits. If I've thought about it...

My jaw hit the floor over this one.
Can anyone read Civil War and say that "Marvel plans well
in advance"?
And I'm not talking about the outcome, I'm talking delays,contradictions, mangling of characterization, etc.

[CaptainCanad]

My jaw hit the floor over this one.
Can anyone read Civil War and say that "Marvel plans well
in advance"?
And I'm not talking about the outcome, I'm talking delays,contradictions, mangling of characterization, etc.
Delays don't result from planning; it's an artist thing. In this case, the point was that they have a general idea, which there's good evidence for; World War Hulk has been in the works for a good while. Contradictions are editorial oversight in the process of many different writers working, not something relating to advance planning; as for characterization, that's caused by individual writers, not something that advance planning concerns.

[santino]

I found Morrison's stint on x-men utterly nonsensical and bewildering. Some of it was likely that I had just returned to comics, but still... it was almost enough to send me packing once again. The only character I liked in the least was Xorn, and we all know how that turned out.

The X-titles, (note I don't read Excalibur, or Exiles, or anything else Claremont goes near, as I think the only thing he has going for him is nostalgia), have finally started hitting their stride again, following the Austen and Morrison debacles. I'm not a huge Shi'ar fan, (or James Proudstar), but am liking Brubaker's run so far anyway, and am really liking X-Men and X-Factor.

I'd be fine with Jean Grey coming back again, if only because the X-Universe needs all the hotties it can get... and with Scott and Emma now a pair, maybe Jean could finally grow as a character for the first time in years. No Phoenix please though.

Thanks in advance. :-)

P.S. I hope Brubaker leaves Vulcan either dead or in space; not a big fan of yet another OMEGA!!11!!!11one! level mutant running around acting like a baby. :)

Edit: Answered my own questions, re: Psylocke, Rogue and Polaris by looking them all up on wikipedia. Sheesh, how silly their various backstories sound when condensed into one page!

[shinra528]

Hey I asked it Wolverine's son was actually the last Mohican. Why didn't that make it into the article? huh? lol

[CaptainB]

Somebody posted earlier that since the Phoenix force is in the background, that Jean is the UXM 354-380 version. But I'm pretty sure it's coming from Rachel, who's in the middle there.

In any event, if that Bachalo piece is a variant to Finch's #200 cover, I'll be getting it instead. The quad-fold cover is terrible! The women have abnormally thick legs. Normally, I wouldn't mind extra-curvy women, but all of these X-Ladies look unnatural. Sorry, I don't want to bash an artist in the industry--some of his work is okay--when people have feet and have masks to cover their identical faces. I'll stop complaining before I get started about what the Prof's lips look like...

Anyway, I really want Astonishing's 13-24 story to fit somewhere in X-canon, but lately, it just seems to be more and more impossible. Scott still has his visor?

[cookepuss]

My jaw hit the floor over this one.

Marvel plans well in advance"?
And I'm not talking about the outcome, I'm talking delays,contradictions, mangling of characterization, etc.
"The best laid plans of mice and men..."

Seriously. They planned the key beats to Civil War fairly well. What they didn't plan well was everything that was tacked on after the initial plan. Civil War was never meant to grow into the beast that it became. It was originally announced as the anti-HoM in that it was supposed to be smaller and more tightly focused. In the begininng, with the release of the first checklist, it seemed that they were sincere about that plan. The problem with a story like Civil War is that the concept lends itself to so many stories and perspectives that it's easy to lose control and indulge in excess.

I've read just about every Civil War related issue, no matter how small. Yeah. I'm one of those guys. So, if you do that, then you're most certainly bound to find inconsistencies. It's inevitable. However, they're rarely so huge as to distract from the core message and events. Most of the time, its an issue of the writers trying to expand on things that simply could not have been addressed in CW proper.

My only problem with the way the tie-in issues is that they often contained redundant scenes. For those who don't buy every tie-in, that's fine. You get your info. For those that bought multiple tie-ins, it was like, "Didn't I just read this exact scene and section of dialog in those other two books?" Not a big fan of reprinted material, especially when I'm paying $3 an issue.

As far as mischaracterization goes, I didn't see it as being that bad of a problem. Read the series from top to bottom again. Your definition of mischaracterization might be clouded by your stance on the SHRA. I didn't have so much of a problem with the way the characters were handled in the core CW.

- Reed being the cold, mad scientist... Here's a guy who stole a freakin' rocket and dragged his best friend, girlfriend, and her teen brother along for a joy ride into space. Here's a guy who's often prioritized his scientific curiosity over his marriage, friendships, and children. Reed's not a bad guy. He's always fighting the good fight, but it's usually from the cold, rational stance. He's never been so great with the social skills either. So, for him to dabble in "dark science" and ignore his family is hardly surprising. For him to do so in a emotionally distanced manner is even less surprising. In his mind, he's doing the right thing.

- Hank being the Clor co-creatin' semi-lackey... Again, not surprising. For one thing, here's a guy who created a robot (Ultron) and based it on his own brain patterns. When said robot goes nuts, you've gotta question the source of the problem. Hank's not exactly stable. In the past, he's gone from mild mannered to darn near whacko on the drop of a hat. He's never been much a leader either, taking his cue from those who are more stable.

- Tony being the seemingly fascist mastermind... Not the way I see it at all. Tony's an inventor. It's consistent in Tony's personality to have him see patterns. For him to see a parallel between the superhuman community and stuff like the old west isn't out of character. To him, acting in favor of legislation is sensible. For him to pull strings and get his hands dirty... Tony was an arms dealer. He was also a politician. Is it that big of a leap to think that he'd play this big game of chess with people's lives if he thought the stakes were that important? It doesn't necessarily make him bad. It just means that he was justifying his actions based on the patterns he's seen. History has a habit of repeating itself. If Tony didn't intervene, the next Stamford could've been 10x worse. Somebody had to play the part of the bad guy. Tony stepped up. Better to take a hit to the rep than to be rounded up by Sentinels.

- Spidey siding with Tony... "With Great Power Comes Great Responsibility," If that doesn't say it all then I think that some people missed the point. Peter's always been about accountability. The superhuman community had grown into a 21st century version of the old west - with people running around playing cops and robbers and letting the innocents get caught in their wake. Eventually, some of those gunslingers were going to have to become state sanctioned marshalls and control those unwilling to play by the rules. Peter's support of the SHRA makes sense. For him to reveal his identity on TV might've been extreme, but it was a sign of maturity. Peter only ever continued to wear the mask because he thought he was protecting his family. Standing so openly in support for registration meant that he was telling other people to be equally responsible. He was putting a human face to issue. The fact that he backed out didn't necessarily mean that he no longer agreed with the act. It just meant that he didn't agree with the lengths to which the government would go to enforce it, including being a pawn in a bigger game.

- Captain America as a whole... What's the problem? The guy's a soldier by trade. A soldier is a gun. You point him at an enemy and shoot. Cap's irrational arrogance is him at his darkest, a warrior born and true. The man's an anachronism. Tony might've been extreme, but he wasn't necessarily wrong. Cap wasn't fighting over a law or an ideal, despite what he claimed. He wasn't even fighting over friendship issues. Cap was fighting over a world that was changing too fast for him. The man spend decades frozen in ice. Defrosted, it took him years to settle into a new world. Just when he gets comfortable, the world and the rules change on him again. Cap's from a different era. To me, it's more realistic if we see cap freaking out. The man's larger than life. His tantrums are bound to be equally so. He wasn't wrong to fight for what he believed in, but he was wrong for fighting it with his fists. Then again, a soldier is a gun. You point him at an enemy and shoot. This time, his enemy was change. Tony was just the face of that change. Pretty nice symbolism too. The man from a bygone era draped in a ideal VS the man encased in a futuristic armor. Past VS Future. As far as Cap's surrender goes, was it THAT surprising? Cap thought he was doing the right thing. He thought that he was fighting for the right to protect the people. It wasn't that firefighters or bystanders stopped him from killing Tony. It was just common sense that finally set it. Cap wasn't any better than Tony. He was willing to sink to nearly the same depths, albeit in a guerilla fashion. Cap, all through out the series was becoming the enemy he was fighting. His conscience finally set in. He realized that he was a gun. He realized that he was being pointed and shot. It just took him forever to realize that whenever he shot, people were getting caught in the crossfire. It wasn't surrender so much as it was the acceptance that came out of denial and anger.

It's funny that we would take stances on fictional legislation. I find myself understanding Tony's POV. Having reread the core series, I don't see either camp being portrayed in a negative fashion. Both sides of the issue seem to be well represented. What I really see is a bunch of people acting petty when they should be fighting the real bad guys. Sounds a whole like the REAL government if you ask me.

CW is an allegory for our post-9/11 world. Some people see mischaracterization. I see consistent characterization merely being framed in a more modern context. These characters are being true to themselves in a way they've never done before. Tony's always had it in him to do the whole "ends justify the means" thing. Cap's always had it in him to fight change like an old man. Reed's always had it in him to be a mad scientist. And so on and so forth. None of that is inconsistent. They're just new spins on existing traits.



Anyway, I know that I'm in the minority here. It's okay if you think I'm totally wrong. I understand your POV too. This is just mine. I think that Marvel did a pretty good job with CW. I only think that they needed to control the bloat. It happened so quickly too.

[Somebody]

Somebody posted earlier that since the Phoenix force is in the background, that Jean is the UXM 354-380 version. But I'm pretty sure it's coming from Rachel, who's in the middle there.
Nope -

(1) It's the wrong Phoenix Effect, - Rachel NEVER manifested the full firebird - she always had the flames wrapped tight around her, with "bladed" wings under her arms and a corona around her head (post-Excalibur #50, the flames replaced her hair instead of acting as a corona, but the same basic deal) - see the Excalibur #1 front and back covers for a good example of the first, and the interiors of Excalbur #65-67 for the second.

2) It's waaaay too far behind her, with Iceman's whole iceslide, not to mention several very distant fliers, showing it's really very far away.

3) Rachel's there as Marvel Girl in her ReLoad costume, and she's not manifested even her Phoenix effect since... well... nominally she did it in her cameo in Cable #82, but they dropped that in later issues in that subplot/arc, so I presume that was an error. Otherwise, she's not done it since being pulled into the future in Excalibur #75. Either way, she was still in the Dark Phoenix costume and calling herself Phoenix at the time, and she's shown no sign of it since returning in XXM.

[Don Mega]

Looks like Marvel is finally willing to save the crumbling X-Men franchise.

This sounds like a very good event.

[Zechs]

Ok so Thunderbird and Warpath get added.. but what about Deadpool? HUH!? WHAT ABOUT DEADPOOL!? Does he get added? No questions about him? *sniffle*

[RedRonin]

Ok so Thunderbird and Warpath get added.. but what about Deadpool? HUH!? WHAT ABOUT DEADPOOL!? Does he get added? No questions about him? *sniffle*
Just cause you wear Marvel Girl's outfit doesn't make you an X-Men.

Lots of cool stuff coming up. Wish they would pull Eaton off of Excalibur and put him on something worth reading.

[Dalarsco]

Yay! Storm and Sal! I just wish Sal was returning to Adjectiveless. I much prefer him to Bachalo and Ramos than I prefer him to Tan and...That guy who filled in for him.

[<sage>]

IIRC: Phoenix was supposed to return in the 90's during Seagle's run. If you can remember, she started wearing the costume again and had Phoenix like abilities develop. The story would have had an armada of alien ships that had been watching Jean in the event of her becoming Phoenix come to Earth and blockade the planet. The editors nixed the idea and brought on the idea of the Magneto War story arc that gave Magneto Genosha (by that stage Seagle was gone).

[Eoghann]

What you deliberately miss is that all the other stuff is still there and irreconcilable. You CAN'T "reverse" this stuff, it doesn't work like that and never has - notice how all the pre-Crisis cruft gradually leaked back into Superman over the course of twenty years, even when it was far more thoroughly nuked than what Morrison did to Phoenix.

All you're doing is saying "IT'S SIMPLER, IT'S SIMPLER" when nothing you say proves it, but instead points out that he just added a layer of cruft on what was already there.

Of course you can and he did. Will other people bring it back? Probably, I think they've started already. But that doesn't change the fact that Morrison simplified things.

Right now Jean Grey was Phoenix and she's dead, that's about all that anyone needs to know about the character which is pretty damn simple.

[Eoghann]

It may be simpler in some ways, but it's also generally unnecessary. You really didn't need to know a damn thing about the Phoenix to understand Jean when I was first reading comics. It was brought up occasionally, but it was also something left largely in the past. There was really no need to bring the Phoenix back at all in my opinion.

Plus, there's the fact that I just don't like the Phoenix.

In fact, I'm going to come right out and say it, I didn't really even care for the original Dark Phoenix Saga. It was overhyped. They explained too much at the end with the Watcher and that Recorder guy. And the death scene meant nothing to me (I know what you'll say. "If she had stayed dead, the death scene would have meant something". Well, I don't care. She came back and it meant nothing to me. I'm a '90s X-Fan, so deal with it). The best thing that came out of that story was the introduction of Kitty Pryde. Jean should have stayed alive and that freakin' bird should have stayed dead except maybe as a simple codename.

By the 90s maybe, but that's only because they'd spent years writing story after tedious story to try and sort out that mess. Bringing her back the first time was a horrible mess of a storyline that screwed up all sorts of things. I'm generally not that bothered about death in comics (whether they stay dead or come back) but that one was just a mess.

I'm trying to think of anything Jean Grey did in the 90s that's even worth remembering and so far I'm drawing a blank. Then again the 90s wasn't exactly a high point for the X-Men on the whole.

[DarkJared]

Any more 12-parters on Uncanny? Brubaker: "No, and I'm sorry for pacing it a little slow at the beginning, but the last two issues are five issues worth of violence."

Damn - I hate what the industry has done to good stories and writers. The current arc on Uncanny has been one of the best in years and he's been criticized for being too slow? It's called plot and character development and suspense. All the tools of a truly great writer.

Ed your uncanny rocks! You make it as 'slow' as you wanna when the story is this good. The pick up in pace is the pay-off for the character work you've done to date on the arc and only caps off the total package you've given us.

[ptlsheriff]

In the cover with the tombs apperar the leaders of the teams of the xmen (and wolverine), but instead of kaos appears Nighcrawler, is this because the mutant who dead in the uncanny xmen (and owner of the tomb) will be Kaos?

I think the dates of the conclussion of the arc match

[IronWolf]

Whoa Exiting X-men news..Wait Exiting X-men news What year is this?!?
some stuff is looking good like that cover to X-men 200 and "Any plans for X-Man?" McCann: "Ask Jeph Loeb, he loves him." Yes Yes Yes YES!!!! come on Jeph give us some X-man!!!!

[theprimedreamer]

Whu...did I just read Kristen Bell and X-Men together....wow.....

[Corey291]

I wonder if the mention of the Ape Beast winning the poll has anything to do with the decidedly [b]un[b/]-catlike Beast drawn in Finch's poster. It looked largely like Jim Lee's Beast there.

-Corey

[AdamYJ]

By the 90s maybe, but that's only because they'd spent years writing story after tedious story to try and sort out that mess. Bringing her back the first time was a horrible mess of a storyline that screwed up all sorts of things. I'm generally not that bothered about death in comics (whether they stay dead or come back) but that one was just a mess.

I'm trying to think of anything Jean Grey did in the 90s that's even worth remembering and so far I'm drawing a blank. Then again the 90s wasn't exactly a high point for the X-Men on the whole.

Watch what you say about the '90s. Whatever people say about those books, it's still my era. It's still what I think of when I think of the X-Men. Not all of us had the fortune to be born at a time in which we could read Claremont's stuff from the beginning. I was born in '82. Lobdell was on board by the time I was into comics. And there are probably a lot more of us out there than people would think. As for Jean, it wasn't any specific event she did as much as the role she played on the team. She was the team's emotional center. She was the group's heart. When Illyana Rasputin died, it was her who talked to Jubilee to help her deal with it. I'd imagine she did the same for everyone else too. Also, she married Cyclops. While that pairing is frowned upon these days, it was quite a high point in the lives of the X-Men. It brought a sense of hope to a year that was fraught with pain and misfortune (Fatal Attractions, Legacy Virus, death of Illyana, Peter defects to the Acolytes, etc).

And I still hate the Phoenix. I like Jean Grey and hate the Phoenix. I'm not even one of those people who wants the X-Men to steer away from cosmic stuff. I like the Strajammers. I like the Imperial Guard. I even like the freakin' Mojoverse, which is way over on the fringes of the X-Men's world. However, I hate that overpowered, overhyped, scene-stealing, bird.

Edit: Okay, maybe I came across a little strongly regarding the '90s thing. However, sometimes I feel like people want me to apologize for liking that era of comics when I read it. Oh, you also have to remember that '90s X-Men was more of a soap opera than anything else. So, it wasn't about what characters did as much as what emotions they added to the pot.

[The Shadow]

Well done, Ed!! :D Lucky bastard... :mad: :mad: :mad: :p :D ;)
That was my thought as well... DAMN I love Kristen Bell.

[Tiger47]

That doesn't mean anything; AXM's story takes place whenever it finishes, so it'll be post-WWH, and post-crossover for all we know.

At the time this was planned, the X-writers probably weren't aware of the sudden, four month delay in AXM due to Cassaday's changing schedule, and probably expected the arc to be done by june when endangered species begins. It would be fairly poor planning to have this supposed mega 2007-2008 event happen before an arc that began in 2006 in their flagship x-book. Unless, of course, nothing happens to the Astonishing team throughout the entire crossover, in which case it seems pretty superfluous as a whole.


She's to the right of Jean.


I was referring to the Bachalo cover, not the Finch cover.

[The Shadow]

I hope Jean stays dead.

Sorry if that's not a popular opinion... but I've never liked the character (my original X-Men books go back to issue #7). the only time I've been a fan was the early X-Factor stuff... and everytime she's dead.

When her and Scott are together it's about as exciting as molasses in the winter time... and I MUCH prefer Emma Frost.

[Acroyear]

Just cause you wear Marvel Girl's outfit doesn't make you an X-Men.

If the only rule for admittance was that you had to have worn a Marvel Girl costume at some point in the past we would all be members of the X-Men!

...

Right?

[The Shadow]

If the only rule for admittance was that you had to have worn a Marvel Girl costume at some point in the past we would all be members of the X-Men!

...

Right?
.... no comment? :( :( :( :eek: :eek: :eek:










:D :D

[CMAAB]

Chris Claremont will make his long-delayed debut on Exiles soon, which was teased on a slide.

WTF? Than who the hell has been writing the book for the last two issues and the one coming out this week also? His name has been on all of the issues. Has he not been writing it? or is the panel retarded? If he hasn't been writing it I sure would like to know who has? I was reluctant to continue buying the book with the creative change but to my surprise it doesn't seem like the book has gone downhill any.

[Novaya Havoc]

Dazzler. Honey. Really. Stop dying your hair; I'm sure it's expensive to keep up and it looks like crap.

I love "Claremont debuts on Exiles!" when 2 issues have already been published.

So jazzed for what Carey is doing, although the Bachalo cover doesn't even touch Finch's. Why must Finch be the variant? <sigh>

And on Kristen Bell:

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g75/TheHuzzah/dazzler.jpg

[Titansmaster]

Alright, where to start??

Not being a regular reader of the X-books for the past several years, buying them only in hit-or-miss fashion, I do have to say that this crossover at the end of the year does sound kinda interesting. Is it gonna be enough to get me to drop probably about $70 - $100 more than usual to read it? Don't know.

Now on to my sore subject. X-MEN FIRST CLASS. How is this different than what John Byrne was doing with HIDDEN YEARS? As far as I can tell FC is re-writing (YET AGAIN) the early years of X-continuity which I am sure will eventually invalidate some stuff published since. At least HY was the original XMen in the time period covered from their last new adventure til they started publishing again as the international group.

Very disappointed that Marvel didn't allow Byrne to continue his title but are now putting this book out there.

[silverbolt]

Now on to my sore subject. X-MEN FIRST CLASS. How is this different than what John Byrne was doing with HIDDEN YEARS? As far as I can tell FC is re-writing (YET AGAIN) the early years of X-continuity which I am sure will eventually invalidate some stuff published since. At least HY was the original XMen in the time period covered from their last new adventure til they started publishing again as the international group.


...aaaaaand this is why i stay away from retroactive series'.

the past should stay the past.

[AdamYJ]

Now on to my sore subject. X-MEN FIRST CLASS. How is this different than what John Byrne was doing with HIDDEN YEARS? As far as I can tell FC is re-writing (YET AGAIN) the early years of X-continuity which I am sure will eventually invalidate some stuff published since. At least HY was the original XMen in the time period covered from their last new adventure til they started publishing again as the international group.

Very disappointed that Marvel didn't allow Byrne to continue his title but are now putting this book out there.

Have you been reading First Class at all?

It's really not rewriting anything. It's also not in continuity at all, to my knowledge. Basically, they're using the early Lee and Kirby days as a springboard to tell more stories about this class of five teenagers without contradicting or rewriting anything.

You have to basically think of X-Men: First Class as Marvel Adventures X-Men (which, incidentally, I heard that it was originally going to be).

[santino]

Yay! Storm and Sal! I just wish Sal was returning to Adjectiveless. I much prefer him to Bachalo and Ramos than I prefer him to Tan and...That guy who filled in for him.

I liked Salvador's initial run on Xtreme X-men, but have not much cared for anything he has done since. And I think Bachalo's art on X-men right now is fantastic...

Opinions will differ, naturally.

[ALIEN_freak_jimbo]

"Can we have some resolution on the Xorn-eto thing?" Brubaker: "I thought Bendis addressed that to everyone's satisfaction in New Avengers," although some in the crowd apparently weren't satisfied.

I wish he had answered this question for those who don't read (or like) everything Bendis touches. Can someone explain the Xorn resolution, please? I recall something about Xorn had a twin brother.... Magneto wasn't really Magneto.... so there's atleast 4 different people involved in that mess, right? Thanks!

[RedRonin]

And on Kristen Bell:

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g75/TheHuzzah/dazzler.jpg Now that I would love to see.

Do you make these? Or is there some site dedicated to "Dazzler-ing" up stars?

[innocentboy]

interesting ...

[zeraze1]

Is that a tweaked Storm costume, or are the bare upper legs a %^&*-up? What's she doing on the [Uncanny] X-Men [cover] anyway, isn't she meant to be off in space or the zombieverse or something with the F4?



From what I've surmised, there's to be a gap in time between Civil War and Storm and Black Panther joining the Fantastic Four. The Morlocks story likely happens there.

zeraze

[Novaya Havoc]

Now that I would love to see.

Do you make these? Or is there some site dedicated to "Dazzler-ing" up stars?

There's no site. Just several people do it. :D

I didn't do Kristen Bell -- but I did do the Minogue in my sig.

[NedPepper]

Watch what you say about the '90s. Whatever people say about those books, it's still my era. It's still what I think of when I think of the X-Men. Not all of us had the fortune to be born at a time in which we could read Claremont's stuff from the beginning. I was born in '82. Lobdell was on board by the time I was into comics. And there are probably a lot more of us out there than people would think. As for Jean, it wasn't any specific event she did as much as the role she played on the team. She was the team's emotional center. She was the group's heart. When Illyana Rasputin died, it was her who talked to Jubilee to help her deal with it. I'd imagine she did the same for everyone else too. Also, she married Cyclops. While that pairing is frowned upon these days, it was quite a high point in the lives of the X-Men. It brought a sense of hope to a year that was fraught with pain and misfortune (Fatal Attractions, Legacy Virus, death of Illyana, Peter defects to the Acolytes, etc).

And I still hate the Phoenix. I like Jean Grey and hate the Phoenix. I'm not even one of those people who wants the X-Men to steer away from cosmic stuff. I like the Strajammers. I like the Imperial Guard. I even like the freakin' Mojoverse, which is way over on the fringes of the X-Men's world. However, I hate that overpowered, overhyped, scene-stealing, bird.

Edit: Okay, maybe I came across a little strongly regarding the '90s thing. However, sometimes I feel like people want me to apologize for liking that era of comics when I read it. Oh, you also have to remember that '90s X-Men was more of a soap opera than anything else. So, it wasn't about what characters did as much as what emotions they added to the pot.


While the X-Men in the 90's was wildly uneven, I enjoyed most of it. For the most part, up until the late 90's when editorial had completely shackled the writers, all most X-Men fans had ever known was Claremont, Lobdell, and Fabian's X-Men. (At least, on the core books.) It's actually unprecendented for such a long period of having only three writers tackle these characters. 'Course, after Lobdell left, Kelly and Seagle were never really allowed to cut loose, and then we got the Alan Davis disaster which I put up there with Chuck Austen as being the worst run ever.

But there are basically two generations of X-fans. The Claremont generation and the Lobdell generation. I came in right at the change over, and I enjoyed a lot of the stories in the 90's, despite all of those damn dangling plot threads. (But to be honest, all those little plot threads were a staple and I could forgive them.) From Fatal Attractions to the Age of Apocalypse, good stuff. I also bought a lot the classic Claremont arcs and enjoyed them immensely. The Hellfire Club/Dark Phoenix saga. The Mutant Massacre. The issue Wolverine lets the Juggernaut kick Colossus' ass for hurting Kitty. Mo-hawk Storm. The Australian Outback era. So I never really could get in the middle of the old internet wars that were basically the pro Claremont fans vs. the Lobdell, Fabian fans. Anyone remember those old wars? I loved both eras, so it didn't really matter to me.

But again, that's three main writers for, what, twenty five years?

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The X-Men don't always agree with a lot of writers, even great writers. Morrison's run was polarizing, but at least it was a high point that people remember. Outside of Morrison, I can't think of one story arc since Lobdell left that has really left an imprint on the two main titles. Not even Wanda's "no more mutants" energized these books. Not Milligan's run. (Which was disappointing for a guy who had shown he knew how to craft a good story.) And it was actually kind of painful to see Claremont come back. It just didn't work anymore. The once all popular X-Men had officially become the ugly step sister or the Avengers in the 90's. (Talk about a 180!)

But things are at least looking up. Whedon, Brubaker, and Carey get the X-Men and it shows in their respective arcs. It's been a long time coming, but the X-Men are coming back. And it's about time!

(And I think any fan who takes a look at that wrap-around cover, an X-fan or not, can see how many great, classic characters have come out of this part of the Marvel Universe and the potential in these great characters.)

[AdamYJ]

While the X-Men in the 90's was wildly uneven, I enjoyed most of it. For the most part, up until the late 90's when editorial had completely shackled the writers, all most X-Men fans had ever known was Claremont, Lobdell, and Fabian's X-Men. (At least, on the core books.) It's actually unprecendented for such a long period of having only three writers tackle these characters. 'Course, after Lobdell left, Kelly and Seagle were never really allowed to cut loose, and then we got the Alan Davis disaster which I put up there with Chuck Austen as being the worst run ever.

But there are basically two generations of X-fans. The Claremont generation and the Lobdell generation.

That cartoon had a lot to do with it. The two generations, I mean.

I came in right at the change over, and I enjoyed a lot of the stories in the 90's, despite all of those damn dangling plot threads. (But to be honest, all those little plot threads were a staple and I could forgive them.)

They're called "plot threads" now. Back then, they were called "mysteries". All those stories had a real way of sucking you in back then. Like a soap opera. Who is the X-Traitor? Why is Jubilee called "The Last X-Man"? Who is the third Summers brother? Is Cable the clone, or is Stryfe? They sure had a way of keeping you revited for at least a little while. Would I want ongoing "mysteries" like that in the X-books again? Hell no! They went on too long. I never even got to see the end of them. The X-Traitor was the big one and it wasn't solved until Onslaught. I was out of comics for a little while by the time Onslaught hit.

From Fatal Attractions to the Age of Apocalypse, good stuff. I also bought a lot the classic Claremont arcs and enjoyed them immensely. The Hellfire Club/Dark Phoenix saga. The Mutant Massacre. The issue Wolverine lets the Juggernaut kick Colossus' ass for hurting Kitty. Mo-hawk Storm. The Australian Outback era. So I never really could get in the middle of the old internet wars that were basically the pro Claremont fans vs. the Lobdell, Fabian fans. Anyone remember those old wars? I loved both eras, so it didn't really matter to me.

I've read a lot of old Claremont stuff by this point too. I've got about five volumes of Essential X-Men on my shelf. However, the X-Men are buried pretty deep in my fanboy psyche. I close my eyes and think of the X-Men and I come up with Cyclops, Wolverine, Beast, Gambit, Jean Grey, Storm, Rogue and Jubilee from the Fox cartoon. Move forward a little bit and I get the Lobdell and Nicieza books from right after Fatal Attractions up until the Age of Apocalypse started. That's the way it probably is for a lot of fans. Their own era is stuck in their psyche.

But again, that's three main writers for, what, twenty five years?

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The X-Men don't always agree with a lot of writers, even great writers. Morrison's run was polarizing, but at least it was a high point that people remember. Outside of Morrison, I can't think of one story arc since Lobdell left that has really left an imprint on the two main titles. Not even Wanda's "no more mutants" energized these books. Not Milligan's run. (Which was disappointing for a guy who had shown he knew how to craft a good story.) And it was actually kind of painful to see Claremont come back. It just didn't work anymore. The once all popular X-Men had officially become the ugly step sister or the Avengers in the 90's. (Talk about a 180!)

But things are at least looking up. Whedon, Brubaker, and Carey get the X-Men and it shows in their respective arcs. It's been a long time coming, but the X-Men are coming back. And it's about time!

(And I think any fan who takes a look at that wrap-around cover, an X-fan or not, can see how many great, classic characters have come out of this part of the Marvel Universe and the potential in these great characters.)

True. The X-Men are a hard nut to crack. The stuff we've got now is pretty darn good. Though, I have to say that I do like some of Claremont's new stuff. I thought X-Treme X-Men started off very good. But that's no problem because he's still doing his stuff on Exiles and New Excalibur.

[Johnny Smith]

The panel was then opened up to Q&A, with Ed Brubaker finally showing up, saying he was delayed because he was giving Veronica Mars star Kristen Bell a signed copy of Captain America #25.

Good excuse for being late! :D

[PreCrisisDC]

Please, please editor(s) of Xmen--return a decent artist to Xmen--Bachalo and Ramos are really not suitable. Geez.

[Sano]

Who cares if Chris Claremont will be writing Exiles? PSYLOCKE WILL BE IN IT - THE HOTTEST X-WOMAN EVER!!! Just get a good artist and I'm good. ;)

[Charlie Hustle]

I remember when Bachalo was a good artist.

[Ex-Villian]

X-Men 200...where's Emma...